Mistek89

The Flow .

N927EV

All I can say is make a pro/con sheet and weigh your options that way. I'm not privy to SkyWest attrition, but I'm sure they have plenty of guys leaving for legacies, majors, and cargo outfits.

eaglefly

Fixing first year pay wont solve the problem. That is essentially what all these bonuses and such were, just veiled carrots to hopefully solve the problem.

It hasn't and it won't.

Personally, I don't think Envoy management CAN solve the problem as it has passed up their bus stop. The problem will soon be bigger then any one regional and is already almost there and only AAG can hope to solve that and it will require a complete overhaul of their relationships with both mainline pilot labor and their regional WO pilots as well. What hasn't passed their bus stop there though IMO, is the treatment of the pilots with what tools management DOES have and that is correctable, but inexplicably sounds as if it is only getting worse. It also sounds to me like the Envoy MEC Chair has morphed into a clone of his predecessors and if so, why he's not facing a recall is beyond me.

I assume the parties that be are likely strategizing their next cheap fix in the hope it works. I'm not very confident of anything other then more can kicking.

N1234

I don't think there is an easy fix for any of this. Most folks are educated enough to look beyond first year pay. What are the base options? How long on reserve? Upgrade times etc. all play into the equation.

It is a package deal - with flow being one of the elements. At the end of the day, people have to eat today and pay bills today and want to enjoy live today - and don't want to defer it to eternity.

Finally, company reputation, culture and history goes a long way. And it takes time to address those. You got to walk the talk. No quick announcement will ever fix that.

buddies8

The envoy mec was under threat of recall but both ord reps caved in under no pressure. Most union reps here except dfw are cowards.

eaglefly

Agreed with most of the above, however I do think the newest generation of pilots are as prone to blind obtainment of immediate gratification as past generations, if not more so. Placing seniority second and shiny metal first is one example of out-of-whack priorities and short-sighted thinking and that blame lies with pilots. Let's face it, no one chases carrots (invisible or otherwise), makes the same errors time and again nor has a history of allowing themselves to fleeced repeatedly like hapless airline pilots. Airlinii Pilotus is entirely predictable in these characteristics and so for those that understand these flaws, they can be manipulated with confidence and so it's like taking candy from a baby.

Perhaps its a defective chromosome somewhere in the DNA chain ?

eaglefly

Not surprising.............garbage in - garbage out.

Mistek89

I'm trying to get an idea of class dates , I was first offered my choice of base and equipment , but now they can't really tell me what classes are going for what since they don't have anything planned out farther then June right now .

Smutter

According to the mec call yesterday. They're about to fill up all the 175 training slots for a good while. So that leaves crj or 145. As for bases, you ask that question like we have choices, we have DFW AND ORD, if you get crj, then you get ORD, if you get 145 then you get one of two, then transfer if you're not happy with the base.

With only two crappy bases, a bottom of the industry contract, flow now stalling, and upgrades MOVING BACK DOWN, pretty much, we're now looking at 6-8 upgrade, and flow, well distant future. Why would you want to come here. Whatever crap this company has to offer, every other regional has more to offer.

Flow= if you're going to wait 10 years, when you can go somewhere else, upgrade quick and begin to apply elsewhere, then you have issues

Upgrade= 6-8 years, even the traditional crappy airlines have better then that

Pay= we're in the bottom 3 of the lowest paid airlines

Contract= pretty bad

Management= our two main guys, are qualified to be low level management at best. They have created a very hostile environment here. Yes, AAG calls the shots, but our management still had to create a culture, all they have created is hate.

Future= nothing, regionals are contracting, we will not grow our fleet much. We may switch to more of a 175 fleet, but we'll dump other planes.

Reserve= sucks everywhere, just sucks a little more here. If I was on reserve here, I would leave.

Schedules= CRJ is 11-12 days off, one end commutable at best.

Like I said, anything we have to offer, every other airline can offer, and offer better. For all of us waiting to flow, we will be behind those that upgrade and move on. United has hired a ton of our pilots, Jetblue takes our fo's all the time, whenever I JS on spirit, one of the pilots is former eagle. Yet, all of us waiting for flow are still here *****ing on this site.

lakehouse

In the coming weeks envoy very well may have industry topped pay scales at least for fos that's something to consider.