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Envoy Airlines Regional Airline

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Old 09-24-2017, 09:45 AM
  #4551  
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Originally Posted by bigtime209
I understand that it's part of the contract. But an email explaining the facts would be nice. The only hint that the pilot group has gotten that the company is going to force FOs to CA if they have to is the 1 page of the vacancy bid that said to update your displacement preferences in case there are insufficient CA bidders. And this hasn't caught ALPA off guard. I talked to a couple of different guys in ALPA leadership a few weeks ago. They knew that this was coming on this vacancy.
Don't forget about the other email. Apparently crews are being naughty and stealing hotel towels and curtains...I took a microwave once. Sent that bad boy through the TSA X-ray and everything.
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Old 09-24-2017, 09:49 AM
  #4552  
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Originally Posted by yeahbutstill
Ok this makes sense. I am good then.
Thanks!!
Did you actually read the regs or are you just taking what's written on here as gospel?
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Old 09-24-2017, 09:51 AM
  #4553  
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Originally Posted by HardLemonade
Don't forget about the other email. Apparently crews are being naughty and stealing hotel towels and curtains...I took a microwave once. Sent that bad boy through the TSA X-ray and everything.
Did it still have a cat inside it?
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Old 09-24-2017, 10:01 AM
  #4554  
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Originally Posted by havick206
Are you saying as a fact that the company is forcing FO's to captain, or are you simply floating a possibility?

Do you really think they would not look at other options rather than having someone sitting in the left seat that
A) just doesn't want to be there; or
B) has been holding off because they don't feel comfortable upgrading for one reason or another?

im pretty sure the company would be discussing alternative options with the union.

It doesn't make financial sense to send someone through a long term course only to get 6-8 months use out of them before flowing.
First the only basis of information I have is the company hi6 saying to update your displacement bids per 15 G 4. The consensus in this thread is company will force FOs to CA. The ONLY way they can fill the unawarded vacancy is to make FOs to CAs.

Second, I think there was some talk about a program similar to the LTFO but via a LOA. I'm sure they have talked about other options I have no clue about.

Finally, this won't even come close to touching senior FOs. Unless the company goes WAY outside the contract. Per my current understanding of how this should play out.

Again, I have guessed and wondered too much about this. I'm gonna go get a beer and wait for the union to put out something about this.
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Old 09-24-2017, 10:10 AM
  #4555  
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Originally Posted by Pedro4President
First the only basis of information I have is the company hi6 saying to update your displacement bids per 15 G 4. The consensus in this thread is company will force FOs to CA. The ONLY way they can fill the unawarded vacancy is to make FOs to CAs.

Second, I think there was some talk about a program similar to the LTFO but via a LOA. I'm sure they have talked about other options I have no clue about.

Finally, this won't even come close to touching senior FOs. Unless the company goes WAY outside the contract. Per my current understanding of how this should play out.

Again, I have guessed and wondered too much about this. I'm gonna go get a beer and wait for the union to put out something about this.
Ever thought that they're laying the groundwork for other options? I could be wrong, but don't suffer from tunnel vision.

To me, this looks like the foundations/ammunition to allow street captains in the near future. This makes much more financial sense getting 4-8 years out of someone as a CA unless they get a job sooner outside of the flow.

Like I said I could be totally wrong, but I've seen this type situation develope before in a similar fashion in a different aviation company.

Last edited by havick206; 09-24-2017 at 10:30 AM.
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Old 09-24-2017, 10:10 AM
  #4556  
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Originally Posted by havick206
Did you actually read the regs or are you just taking what's written on here as gospel?

Nah I didnt read the regs but Envoy told me I could start with 1458 and I could use CAE and their sim time towards the 1500.. I was just confused about the TT deal.
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Old 09-24-2017, 10:32 AM
  #4557  
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Originally Posted by havick206
Ever thought that they're laying the groundwork for other options? I could be wrong, but don't suffer from tunnel vision.

To me, this looks like the foundations/ammunition to allow street captains in the near future. This makes much more financial sense getting 4-8 years out of someone as a CA unless they get a job sooner outside of the flow.

Like I said I could be totally wrong, but I've seen this type situation develope before in a similar fashion in a different aviation company.
You think DEC? I wouldn't be shocked to see CA slots offered to NHs instead hiring them on as a captain.
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Old 09-24-2017, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Pedro4President
You think DEC? I wouldn't be shocked to see CA slots offered to NHs instead hiring them on as a captain.
i don't pretend to know all the ins and outs of how an official street CA stream could eventuate. All I'm trying to say is the way you speak on here just stresses people out. There's always more to the story and other avenues that you haven't thought of.

Just think logically about things. There's always a means to amend the contract via an LOA if it works for everyone. Nothing is ever set in stone in aviation.

Like I said I could be totally wrong, but in the meantime just relax and see how it plays out rather than spewing (the company is trying to screw us every which way) garbage.
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Old 09-24-2017, 11:15 AM
  #4559  
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Originally Posted by yeahbutstill
Nah I didnt read the regs but Envoy told me I could start with 1458 and I could use CAE and their sim time towards the 1500.. I was just confused about the TT deal.

61.159(a)(6)
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Old 09-24-2017, 11:20 AM
  #4560  
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Originally Posted by havick206
i don't pretend to know all the ins and outs of how an official street CA stream could eventuate. All I'm trying to say is the way you speak on here just stresses people out. There's always more to the story and other avenues that you haven't thought of.

Just think logically about things. There's always a means to amend the contract via an LOA if it works for everyone. Nothing is ever set in stone in aviation.

Like I said I could be totally wrong, but in the meantime just relax and see how it plays out rather than spewing (the company is trying to screw us every which way) garbage.
So should we just ignore the warning shot the company tossed at us in the HI6s? P4P's points are all valid. Maybe the union and the company are working on something, but until that announced, folks should prepare accordingly that the vacancies will be assigned per the contract.
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