A few more than that. Some don't have class dates at Kalitta until January.

 

Actually never heard of that. I always get higher time lines and swap for the same. I need $ so I fly high time every month. Anything you pick up should go on top of guarantee.

 

I agree but that's not the case. Not one line out of ORD in October is worth 75 hours.

 

Trip pickup in the ILIW is working for free if your line credit is below 75 hours. If your line credit is 65 hours, you get paid the 75 hour guarantee. If you then pick up a 5 hour day trip in the ILIW, you are working for free, ie: no extra pay on top of your 75 hour guarantee. Wait for the SLIW to pick up and it's add pay on top of 75 hour guarantee.

 

Senior pilot: Life is good.
Mid seniority pilot: Thank god for the ILIW.
Junior pilot: Can't wait to be a lineholder.

I've been a junior lineholder the entire 12 years I've been a lineholder. I consider myself lucky compared to others struggling with reserve. If we didn't have the ILIW and SLIW during that time, I would be tens of thousands of dollars poorer and have worked countless trips that I didn't want. I am very thankful that the negotiators we've had over the years during and since contract 04 had the foresight to make something exceptional out of our line bidding process. With trip dropping because of vacations, many of us less senior lineholders have been able to live a much better life because of the ILIW and SLIW.

With our line bidding process (Blackhawk), I invite you to explain to us how those trips dropped because of vacation touch would be incorporated into a line award. If the issue is that you feel your seniority is abrogated because of this process, why don't you explain that to all of the junior lineholders who depend on the ILIW and SLIW to make our lives better. I'm sure you'll get a warm reception at how your seniority rewards are more important than their QOL.

Sorry for the rant but I'm a little tired of hearing about how a senior pilot feels butt hurt over a perceived slight because of what a junior pilot is able to do. BTW, those complaints are almost exclusively made by pilots outside of our pilot group, from my experience over the last 17+ years. Our system has worked well for everyone on property since contract 04. Is the ILIW a perfect solution? No, but the best we could negotiate at the time. That first 30 seconds is a ***** sometimes! It is what it is. Maybe we'll see some improvements on the next contract.

 

Not even working under the xjt contract and already complaining? I think you are gonna have to get used to the way seniority is treated on the xjt side. Personally, I think it was smart of the union to come up with sort of an egalitarian system for a few contract items. After all, it’s called a union where we look out for each other, not a every-man-for-himself. That’s why you’ll be bidding for your 4 weeks of vacation in 4 rounds, not all at once. And that’s why you’ll accrue 5 hours of sick bank every month regardless of seniority. If it was done by seniority like on the Asa side, the really senior pilots would be accruing 8 hours a month while new hires get 3, or something of that effect.

On the other hand, I do feel the ILIW is a pain. And it does suck to have to try to get that day off each month. Unless of course if you are senior, then you get the best lines anyway and probably the ILIW off since your line has so many days off. It probably would be better to have PBS and an ILIW like the PBS LOA envisions.

By the way, anything you pick up (advertised or open trip) is add pay if during the SLIW. Not so during the ILIW.

 

When we had line bidding we had relief lines. Those trips were awarded to junior pilots who would normally get reserve. If I remember correctly (it's been a while), there was actually a window when pilots could trade for these open time trips if desired, but they were awarded in seniority order. Sometimes I lost out on these trips to senior pilots. That's how it goes. Again, it's called "seniority". Get used to it as the rest of the airline industry uses it. While it may not seem "fair", it rewards those who have been with the company the longest rather than relying on a capricious system based upon who is fastest on a keyboard and is actually able to be on a computer in a short period of time.
If you read up through this thread you will actually see other XJT pilots complaining about it. At least I assume they are XJT pilots.
Sometimes we get used to what we have and everything else seems like crap. I've heard that from many LASA pilots about line bidding. Personally, my feeling was it's coming anyway, I'll wait and see how it is. This is one item I and many others don't like.

 

Actually, I am working under the XJT contract. October bidding in ORD is IAW the XJT contract.
There are some aspects of the contract I like. I'm not dogging everything in the contract. But it's ironic that you would say you like your contract because it's not "every man for himself", but that's essentially what ILIW IS. Every man for himself.
Also, ALPA did fight long and hard for seniority. Prior to that upgrades, furloughs, everything was at the whim of the company. If they liked you, you upgraded. If they didn't like you or you were an ALPA rep, you got furloughed first. Do you really want to get rid of that? Do you want your upgrade to be "fair" instead of rewarding those who've been on property the longest?

 

When I hear “this is how we used to do it”, I’m officially checking out of the conversation.

 

Someone asked how it should be done so I was just giving an example. But yeah, I don't like that either and will try to keep my mouth shut about it on the line. Nothing worse than hearing from a pilot in the other seat how his now-defunct airline was much better in every way possible.