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Old 12-10-2018 | 02:06 PM
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Originally Posted by calmwinds
Well, Kelvin. Never said the 717 was a flow (or flop). I said it was a flop with passengers. What American airline other than Delta use it? How many new 717’s are being built? What DC9 variant is still being built? And, why?
Yep, autocorrect said flow. That doesn’t make any of what I said less true. I’d really like to know where you got the idea that the 717 is a flop with passengers, especially compared to the RJs they replaced on many routes.

Is Hawaiian not an American airline?
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Old 12-10-2018 | 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by KelvinHelmholtz
Is Hawaiian not an American airline?
It sure is, and so is (was) AirTran.
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Old 12-10-2018 | 02:24 PM
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Originally Posted by DarkSideMoon
Do you think 90% of pax take aircraft type into account when they’re buying tickets?

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press-releases/jd-power-2018-north-america-airline-satisfaction-study

Delta is a solid #2 with one of the oldest fleets in the country. Alaska is flying arguably the worst narrowbody as far as comfort and they’re well above the relatively modern American and United.

Economy people care about getting where they need to go at a price and time that is convenient to them. Business class people are going to have a comfortable ride no matter what equipment is on that route.

Most of the flying public are not airplane nerds.
And, why does American, United, Delta, and Alaska fly the Ejet when the CRJ900 is more significantly more cost effective? And, business travelers don’t all ride in the front. Many last minute business travelers buy fares where they are stuck in the back in a middle seat.
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Old 12-10-2018 | 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by PhantomHawk
It sure is, and so is (was) AirTran.
AirTran now flies 737’s after they merged with Southwest. Where do you think Delta got their 717’s? Southwest dumped AirTran’s 717s on Delta.
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Old 12-10-2018 | 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by calmwinds
And, why does American, United, Delta, and Alaska fly the Ejet when the CRJ900 is more significantly more cost effective? And, business travelers don’t all ride in the front. Many last minute business travelers buy fares where they are stuck in the back in a middle seat.
Is it really more cost effective if it would cause them to lose business to an operator offering a better product?
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Old 12-10-2018 | 02:38 PM
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The 717 flopped but not because of passenger’s preference. It’s still way nicer from a passenger’s perspective than any CRJ.

Delta flies the 717 for one and only one reason—it’s a relatively modern airplane and they got them for dirt cheap.
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Old 12-10-2018 | 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by calmwinds
And, why does American, United, Delta, and Alaska fly the Ejet when the CRJ900 is more significantly more cost effective? And, business travelers don’t all ride in the front. Many last minute business travelers buy fares where they are stuck in the back in a middle seat.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯. Still doesn’t change the fact that fleet type is not a huge indicator of consumer satisfaction. Hell, I flew IAD-ORD in a -200 last week. People will buy the ticket that gets them there at the time they want to arrive in the price point that they can afford.
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Old 12-10-2018 | 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by DarkSideMoon
¯\_(ツ)_/¯. Still doesn’t change the fact that fleet type is not a huge indicator of consumer satisfaction. Hell, I flew IAD-ORD in a -200 last week. People will buy the ticket that gets them there at the time they want to arrive in the price point that they can afford.
Then, why is United retiring every CRJ700 (except SkyWest’s Aspen 700’s) by the end of 2020 in lieu of the E175SC? Why have the Ejet at all?
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Old 12-10-2018 | 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by calmwinds
AirTran now flies 737’s after they merged with Southwest. Where do you think Delta got their 717’s? Southwest dumped AirTran’s 717s on Delta.
AirTran doesn’t fly anything. That’s like saying Mesaba flies CRJ 900s or Shuttle America flies 170s.

No one dumped anything on Delta. Southwest didn’t want them since they wanted to keep an all 737 fleet. 717 operations allowed Delta to reduce 50 seat RJ flying significantly, and offer much better service on many routes. It seems as if you like to argue about a lot of things you really know nothing about, and it’s clearer than ever here.
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Old 12-10-2018 | 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by KelvinHelmholtz
AirTran doesn’t fly anything. That’s like saying Mesaba flies CRJ 900s or Shuttle America flies 170s.

No one dumped anything on Delta. Southwest didn’t want them since they wanted to keep an all 737 fleet. 717 operations allowed Delta to reduce 50 seat RJ flying significantly, and offer much better service on many routes. It seems as if you like to argue about a lot of things you really know nothing about, and it’s clearer than ever here.
Well, the AirTran pilots and FA’s were merged into Southwest’s seniority list and many are flying 737’s. The gates in Atlanta and AirTran routes were retained by Southwest.

You make a lot of excuses for an airplane and a type rating that won’t be of value in the next few years anywhere other than Delta. If you are at Delta, you will simply move on to a better aircraft at some point.

AirTran isn’t like an airline just folded up like Great Lakes. All the flight crews landed on their feet. It is like when USAirways and American merged. Did USAirways go away?
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