Time to create a NAI blacklist?
12-11-2016, 06:58 PM
#31
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Joined APC: May 2014
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Posts: 504
Originally Posted by sweetholyjesus
Well said. No one seemed to care about their countrymens' careers when pilots voted scope away to pad their own paychecks. I'm sure these same outraged pilots would support NAI in a heartbeat if there was a nickle in it for them..
12-13-2016, 08:58 AM
#32
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Joined APC: Nov 2009
Posts: 5,192
Originally Posted by NEDude
I gave you my full disclosure in my last post:
"I already have a nice job with a small European charter airline and I am quite content to stay right where I am. But I have seen the effect that Norwegian has had on my salary because my pay and work schedule has improved in order to try and stem the tide of pilots going to Norwegian. So I am quite happy to see Norwegian hiring."
Regarding the pilots who go to Norwegian having to spend their career with subpar wages: Do you really think things will stay exactly as they are now forever? If so you have not been in the industry very long. Did the pilots who went to PeoplExpress in the 1980s suffer from subpar wages for their entire careers? Some of those guys are now senior United Captains in case you were not aware (PeoplExpress bought by Continental...Continental merged with United). Southwest used to have very subpar wages, but spent much of the 2000s and early 2010s as the best paying U.S. passenger airline.
Lastly, how do you see NAI jobs based in FLL as going "overseas"? Did Ft Lauderdale secede from the union and I miss it?
"I already have a nice job with a small European charter airline and I am quite content to stay right where I am. But I have seen the effect that Norwegian has had on my salary because my pay and work schedule has improved in order to try and stem the tide of pilots going to Norwegian. So I am quite happy to see Norwegian hiring."
Regarding the pilots who go to Norwegian having to spend their career with subpar wages: Do you really think things will stay exactly as they are now forever? If so you have not been in the industry very long. Did the pilots who went to PeoplExpress in the 1980s suffer from subpar wages for their entire careers? Some of those guys are now senior United Captains in case you were not aware (PeoplExpress bought by Continental...Continental merged with United). Southwest used to have very subpar wages, but spent much of the 2000s and early 2010s as the best paying U.S. passenger airline.
Lastly, how do you see NAI jobs based in FLL as going "overseas"? Did Ft Lauderdale secede from the union and I miss it?
An NAI pilot is employed as an independent contractor. When your contract is up, you're gone or you can reapply/renew. Been there 5 years and expecting a raise? How about no, we have plenty of applicants to replace you. We'll renew your contract at the current rate, maybe even lower, or just not at all. All those sick calls you took from only having 10 days a month off? Yeah we're not interested in renewing your contract.
This is why they're structured the way the are. They will control their labor costs as long as there are jackass *****s willing to sell out the profession, and themselves. Your comparison does not apply.
12-13-2016, 11:44 AM
#34
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Joined APC: Mar 2016
Position: Gear Biatch
Posts: 266
Originally Posted by 9easy
I think it's time for ALPA, IBT, SWAPA, APA, and whoever else to ban together and declare that working for Norwegian or any subsidiary is only a small step above crossing a picket line and will not be tolerated.
1. Lifetime Jumpseat ban and creation of a blackball list
2. To the extent possible, banned from being hired at any other US Airline for the rest of their careers
3. No zed agreements with any NAI subsidiary
Unlike most union efforts, most mainline airline management (except JetBlue) probably hate NAI as much as we do and could be quite agreeable to make this happen.
1. Lifetime Jumpseat ban and creation of a blackball list
2. To the extent possible, banned from being hired at any other US Airline for the rest of their careers
3. No zed agreements with any NAI subsidiary
Unlike most union efforts, most mainline airline management (except JetBlue) probably hate NAI as much as we do and could be quite agreeable to make this happen.
What a moronic thing to say or even recommend.
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12-13-2016, 05:26 PM
#35
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Joined APC: Nov 2009
Posts: 5,192
Originally Posted by PotatoChip
PeopleExpress was unionized???
12-13-2016, 05:45 PM
#36
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Position: Seated
Posts: 4,310
Originally Posted by Grumble
Once merged with CAL. Point remains the same, they weren't independant contractors. They were employees with the ability to collectively bargain if they sought to however. Something that can't be done at NAI (yet), thus don't plan on wages going up. Especially with the 400 apps they got for 25 FLL based jobs. Based on that they could actually pay less.
Contract pilots never receive pay raises?
12-13-2016, 08:57 PM
#38
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Joined APC: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,067
Originally Posted by PotatoChip
Wages only go up if you're unionized??
Contract pilots never receive pay raises?
Contract pilots never receive pay raises?
It seems to me that pay is overwhelmingly determined by the financial health of the airline combined with the supply and demand for pilots. For example: after 9/11, many airlines were struggling financially and many pilots lost their jobs. Despite union contracts and the ability to collectively bargain, pilot pay dropped significantly. Now airlines doing very well financially and the supply of pilots, at least on the lower end, is limited. The result is pilot pay is increasing. The next time airlines begin to struggle financially, pay will decrease again. History shows that it will, and only a fool would seriously believe otherwise.
12-13-2016, 08:57 PM
#39
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Position: B-737NG preferably in first class with a glass of champagne and caviar
Posts: 5,909
Originally Posted by PotatoChip
Wages only go up if you're unionized??
Contract pilots never receive pay raises?
Contract pilots never receive pay raises?
.
12-14-2016, 03:24 AM
#40
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Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 471
Originally Posted by Grumble
You're missing one key point in that comparison. Those are all union jobs.
An NAI pilot is employed as an independent contractor. When your contract is up, you're gone or you can reapply/renew. Been there 5 years and expecting a raise? How about no, we have plenty of applicants to replace you. We'll renew your contract at the current rate, maybe even lower, or just not at all. All those sick calls you took from only having 10 days a month off? Yeah we're not interested in renewing your contract.
This is why they're structured the way the are. They will control their labor costs as long as there are jackass *****s willing to sell out the profession, and themselves. Your comparison does not apply.
An NAI pilot is employed as an independent contractor. When your contract is up, you're gone or you can reapply/renew. Been there 5 years and expecting a raise? How about no, we have plenty of applicants to replace you. We'll renew your contract at the current rate, maybe even lower, or just not at all. All those sick calls you took from only having 10 days a month off? Yeah we're not interested in renewing your contract.
This is why they're structured the way the are. They will control their labor costs as long as there are jackass *****s willing to sell out the profession, and themselves. Your comparison does not apply.
"jackass *****s"?
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