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Old 12-04-2017, 09:12 AM
  #4881  
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Originally Posted by BeatNavy View Post
The metric of math? Thatís one of the dumbest things Iíve read in a while. Are you saying 100/3500 is a small percentage? Just because 1/35, or ~3% sounds small, doesnít mean itís a low number for this application. Let me pose this question: if 100 out of 3500 people murdered or raped people, is that ok because ďitís a low number?Ē

100 people are getting a free ride at the expense of their peers. 100 people, many of whom are captains making over $250k, are riding the negotiation/CBA coattails of FOs making $50-$150k because they are too selfish, anti-ALPA, ďscrewed by ALPA at a previous carrier,Ē or have other stupid reasons to not pay. Itís one thing to vote no, itís quite another to not pay dues. ALPA is what we have now. It is what it is. To continue being a nonmember, knowing you have to pay a contract mx fee once a contract is ratified/implemented, is basically taking a huge pay increase at the expense of others to save 1.9% a year for a 3-5 year period. That number should be 0%.

Just because a fraction or percentage is a seemingly small number doesnít mean our number of nonmembers is low. 100 selfish A holes out there who would likely cross a picket line and who prefer other pilots pay for their gains in pay/QOL. F them. I wish they had the option to stay on an old PEA with no union representation for anything.

Lol, oh please. Layoff the caffeine.
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Old 12-04-2017, 09:19 AM
  #4882  
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Originally Posted by BeatNavy View Post
To continue being a nonmember, knowing you have to pay a contract mx fee once a contract is ratified/implemented, is basically taking a huge pay increase at the expense of others to save 1.9% a year for a 3-5 year period.
Assuming standard ALPA Agency Shop language, they will owe back dues/service fee to the date ALPA came on property (EN time will be excluded). That's going to be a 5 figure check for most of the NM captains to write. ALPA will offer the opportunity for a payment plan, or the opportunity to resign.
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Old 12-04-2017, 09:25 AM
  #4883  
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Originally Posted by Chicken Taco View Post
Assuming standard ALPA Agency Shop language, they will owe back dues/service fee to the date ALPA came on property (EN time will be excluded). That's going to be a 5 figure check for most of the NM captains to write. ALPA will offer the opportunity for a payment plan, or the opportunity to resign.
They will owe only from the day the contract is ratified.
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Old 12-04-2017, 10:03 AM
  #4884  
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Originally Posted by Chicken Taco View Post
Assuming standard ALPA Agency Shop language, they will owe back dues/service fee to the date ALPA came on property (EN time will be excluded). That's going to be a 5 figure check for most of the NM captains to write. ALPA will offer the opportunity for a payment plan, or the opportunity to resign.
I wish this was true. I've heard both ways.
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Old 12-04-2017, 10:10 AM
  #4885  
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Originally Posted by BeatNavy View Post
The metric of math? Thatís one of the dumbest things Iíve read in a while. Are you saying 100/3500 is a small percentage? Just because 1/35, or ~3% sounds small, doesnít mean itís a low number for this application. Let me pose this question: if 100 out of 3500 people murdered or raped people, is that ok because ďitís a low number?Ē

100 people are getting a free ride at the expense of their peers. 100 people, many of whom are captains making over $250k, are riding the negotiation/CBA coattails of FOs making $50-$150k because they are too selfish, anti-ALPA, ďscrewed by ALPA at a previous carrier,Ē or have other stupid reasons to not pay. Itís one thing to vote no, itís quite another to not pay dues. ALPA is what we have now. It is what it is. To continue being a nonmember, knowing you have to pay a contract mx fee once a contract is ratified/implemented, is basically taking a huge pay increase at the expense of others to save 1.9% a year for a 3-5 year period. That number should be 0%.

Just because a fraction or percentage is a seemingly small number doesnít mean our number of nonmembers is low. 100 selfish A holes out there who would likely cross a picket line and who prefer other pilots pay for their gains in pay/QOL. F them. I wish they had the option to stay on an old PEA with no union representation for anything.
So ďmetric of mathĒ is the dumbest thing Iíd ever read too, until I read your comparison of NMs to rapists and murderers. I think my stance on NMs has been pretty clear, F em, but that was thoroughly stupid.
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Old 12-04-2017, 10:15 AM
  #4886  
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Originally Posted by Chicken Taco View Post
99 Total on the list. 14 are EN, so only 85 line pilots.

At least 2 of the EN recently retired but are still listed, so the active total is 97 or less. The seniority list as of now is about 3550 (best guess of 3489 from the last system bid plus 20/mo). That's 2.73% of the total list or about 1 in every 37 pilots.
There are also at least 2 scabs, and a handful of guys over the age of 60 who are gambling that they will retire before they would ever see a benefit from our CBA. Thatís not intended as an excuse, Iím merely pointing it out to say that the NM list will likely continue shrink as those deadbeats retire over the next few years.
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Old 12-04-2017, 10:25 AM
  #4887  
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Originally Posted by BeatNavy View Post
The metric of math? Thatís one of the dumbest things Iíve read in a while. Are you saying 100/3500 is a small percentage? Just because 1/35, or ~3% sounds small, doesnít mean itís a low number for this application. Let me pose this question: if 100 out of 3500 people murdered or raped people, is that ok because ďitís a low number?Ē

100 people are getting a free ride at the expense of their peers. 100 people, many of whom are captains making over $250k, are riding the negotiation/CBA coattails of FOs making $50-$150k because they are too selfish, anti-ALPA, ďscrewed by ALPA at a previous carrier,Ē or have other stupid reasons to not pay. Itís one thing to vote no, itís quite another to not pay dues. ALPA is what we have now. It is what it is. To continue being a nonmember, knowing you have to pay a contract mx fee once a contract is ratified/implemented, is basically taking a huge pay increase at the expense of others to save 1.9% a year for a 3-5 year period. That number should be 0%.

Just because a fraction or percentage is a seemingly small number doesnít mean our number of nonmembers is low. 100 selfish A holes out there who would likely cross a picket line and who prefer other pilots pay for their gains in pay/QOL. F them. I wish they had the option to stay on an old PEA with no union representation for anything.
I like paragraphs two and three!

Gup
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Old 12-04-2017, 12:34 PM
  #4888  
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Originally Posted by slimothy View Post
So ďmetric of mathĒ is the dumbest thing Iíd ever read too, until I read your comparison of NMs to rapists and murderers. I think my stance on NMs has been pretty clear, F em, but that was thoroughly stupid.
I didnít compare the two, I used an exaggeration to prove a point that a seemingly small fraction doesnít mean a small/insignificant number depending on the context. But you knew that.
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Old 12-04-2017, 04:57 PM
  #4889  
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Originally Posted by Xbrit View Post
They will owe only from the day the contract is ratified.


This is likely accurate, since we have no CBA in place now. The union cannot compel dues until thereís a CBA in place doing so. They will definitely owe agency fees after the CBA is ratified. They would be silly to not join, as they are costing themselves the right to vote and participate with their bargaining agent.


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Old 12-04-2017, 05:46 PM
  #4890  
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Originally Posted by slimothy View Post
There are also at least 2 scabs, and a handful of guys over the age of 60 who are gambling that they will retire before they would ever see a benefit from our CBA. Thatís not intended as an excuse, Iím merely pointing it out to say that the NM list will likely continue shrink as those deadbeats retire over the next few years.
Didn't realize we had a few scabs. Comair guys? That was the last time scabs have happened correct?
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