Kingsley did it in response to many line pilot complaints, and also many MEC members were also fed up with the bee-ess and the lies that were constantly being distributed without a response.

Not in the slightest. Your version of history was apparently "revised" though. I was there for the whole thing and I will never forget it.

Were you there too? I'd love to hear your first-hand account of that Special MEC meeting.

 

Shiz,

There is a lot of BS in our union and it comes from both camps(sorta like D's and R's). It's obvious that as a relative new hire you bought in and side with one side. While I don't like or agree with the side you have aligned with, at least you gave your time unlike many others here.

 

I believe you, but I doubt nationals resolved to maximize the scope of flying operatied Delta and United pilots.

This is my primary concern.


I wish Denny, but I am afraid that ALPA won't "just keep scope exactly where it is..." because of current paradigm.

Hundreds of regional aircraft have been ordered for scope clauses that do not yet exist. Why are we not upset about this?


Agreed!!!

 

That's such a hollow threat, it's probably difficult to formulate it with s straight face. Independently if anything ALPA does well or poorly, the DPA has demonstrated it's incapable of actually doing anything at all, beyond public tantrums.

Saying that DPA would be a credible alternative if ALPA screws up is like telling your wife you're going to leave her for another woman up the street, if you can't work things out. This might be effective initially, until your wife has met the other woman, who lives in a trailer, and dabbles in crystal-meth with her babby-daddies.

Truth is, it's a wiser investment to improve what we have. There is no magic union that's going to show up and fix things. People can wish upon a star, or they can put green tags on their bags all day long, but that's not going to turn Caplinger's hobby into an actual union.

 

Sadly, that's a hollow wish.

Carl

 

Carl

This where I disagree with you and other DPA supporters. Fortunately or unfortunately depending on your point of view DPA is on life support with only a slim chance to get to a vote in its current set up. The very thing you say about ALPA, it's inability to change, is the same issue with DPA.

In my opinion TC is a huge problem/liability for DPA. In my case I signed my DPA card in spite of TC being the leader. I had read his posts on the former NWA ALPA forum and he came across as a bitter disgruntled person. However, I liked the party platform of independence, no RJ representation, and few other items. So I signed my card and started getting the emails and updates. TC and DPA lost me with the comparison of our contract to a Chinese abortion. The updates had begun to read like they are being written by a conspiracy theorist with a tin foil hat, that one put me on the outside looking in. I saw the same bitter pilot from the web boards not a leader looking to better my representation. Guess what TC is not going to stop being the face of DPA. Now if he does step down and you can get some guys with name recognition from both North and South to step in as the new face with a corresponding change in how the message is delivered then they can start to move back to relevance.

As for ALPA and change I do think it is possible and honestly not that hard if guys are willing to get off their buts and simply vote. MSP just had a vote and less than 1/3 of pilots voted. Imagine if the DPA voters backed their candidates in local elections and got them into office. Just by turning over ATL for example, based on the recent MEC votes, you could get rid of the long time insider volunteers that DPA and many others have and issue with. In 3 years, less time than DPA has existed and made no change and little impact they could have flipped the face of the MEC.

As for National we both know Delta and United are the big dues paying members that keep it relevant. If Delta and United looked to push national in another direction I don't see how it would be stopped. The ALPA name on Capitol Hill has value, much more so than CAPA.

 

You've got to love these little psych experiments like DPA. If pilots expended half the wasted DPA -type energy on participating and improving ALPA we would be far better off mostly because it would cause more pilots to be more realistic about the challenges we face. Pilots think they know all about things whether they are actually encumbered by any actual experience doing it and we hate politics. Well, too bad. As DPA and its carcass prove politics are inevitable and herding cats is not easy.

 

ALPA national's experiments are no less interesting...even ironic. If ALPA national expended half the wasted energy it spent trying to break it's clerical workers' union and misrepresenting TWA pilots, the savings on lawsuit losses alone would have made us a healthier union. Both financially healthier and more unified.

Translation: ALPA has no desire to be involved in any labor risk. All you line pukes need to adjust your ridiculous and unjustified expectations accordingly.

Carl

 

Carl with the beatdown.

Flytolive: what is your agenda?

 

I wouldn't go so far as to call it a beatdown. More like same old, same old. As for the agenda, it sounds like it's diametrically opposed to yours.