Originally Posted by wt932051

In my experience I will tell you what will happen if we vote no too!

1) We will make the news as yet another pilot group not willing to work for nothing.

2) Once the airplane deliveries stop, no matter if we vote yes or no, and the FO's we currently have realize they won't get an upgrade and have to live under poverty wages, they will start to go to PSA, etc., cancellations will start due to lack of crew. Mesa will panic. They will do one of two things. Tell United and American we need more money, or two, send those planes to another regional. Gonna happen either way. By voting yes, guys still are not going to want to work here. So it does not matter. We would need a MUCH better FO pay scale for guys to stay. This is why we need to vote no until our FO pay matches the others.

3) Flaps will be downgraded back to the right seat if he ever makes it in the left.

4) Senior lifers do care that the FO's hold out for better too. It benefits all of us both now and in the long run. Its guys like Flaps who want you to vote the same as him (yes) so you help benefit him and get him is upgrade, but meanwhile selling out the rest.


5) The majors are almost maxed out on scope so they would just start sending planes from one to the next but as a FO if you jump ship, will you be able to climb that huge FO list to get that upgrade in time before cancellations at that new regional keep you at the bottom? Your best bet is to finish climbing the ladder at Mesa and because you can right now, hold out for better pay.

6) We don't need to go on strike. The cancellations from both Captains and FO's leaving will have the same effect.

7) Senior Captains were also once FO's and also once on Reserve. They want you to have better, not worse.

Originally Posted by flapshalfspeed

I'm already an EJet Captain, broseph--have been for a while now.

Originally Posted by deltajuliet

$14,700,000 / ~1200 pilots / 60 months = $204.17 more for each pilot every month, or roughly a $2.50 hourly increase for everyone. That would be worth considering. A 1% pay increase equates to 22 cents more an hour for new FO's or around a dollar for a topped out 19-year Captain. I recognize eliminating the 50 seat base rate and enhancing certain work rules cost the company money, but unless those FO pay rates have been improved far more than 1%, what's the discrepancy between $2.50 and $0.22-1.00?

Originally Posted by wt932051

Well then congrats on the upgrade.

I love our battles btw. I won the war though. lol

Originally Posted by flapshalfspeed

Separating out all of the emotions about what we truly deserve to be paid, we need to consider two possible truths:

1) The ALPA-hired CPAs, attorneys, professional advisors, MEC, and negotiating committee members are telling the truth--Mesa is broke. In this scenario, the hard truth many of you are having trouble stomaching is this: "We are broke airline pilots flying for a broke airline."

alternatively

2) The ALPA-hired CPAs, attorneys, professional advisors, MEC, and negotiating committee members are all risking their reputations, professional certifications/incomes, and elected positions in a massive cover-up to help Mesa executives conceal the company's true financial state and codeshare revenues. JO is making ungodly profits on those codeshare agreements we underbid every other regional in the United States to secure, and he has somehow convinced all of the above individuals to literally risk their livelihoods in going along with his evil cover-up and plan for world domination.

I'm leaning towards truth #1

Originally Posted by flapshalfspeed

Separating out all of the emotions about what we truly deserve to be paid, we need to consider two possible truths:

1) The ALPA-hired CPAs, attorneys, professional advisors, MEC, and negotiating committee members are telling the truth--Mesa is broke. In this scenario, the hard truth many of you are having trouble stomaching is this: "We are broke airline pilots flying for a broke airline."

alternatively

2) The ALPA-hired CPAs, attorneys, professional advisors, MEC, and negotiating committee members are all risking their reputations, professional certifications/incomes, and elected positions in a massive cover-up to help Mesa executives conceal the company's true financial state and codeshare revenues. JO is making ungodly profits on those codeshare agreements we underbid every other regional in the United States to secure, and he has somehow convinced all of the above individuals to literally risk their livelihoods in going along with his evil cover-up and plan for world domination.

I'm leaning towards truth #1

Originally Posted by flapshalfspeed

Vote for the TA and you can come on over to IAH and pontificate on these matters in person. I will win the war.

Originally Posted by flapshalfspeed

FO payrates are increased much more than 1%--you don't have the scale in front of you. The Exec summary didn't really make that clear.

Payraises for years 2-9 FO are much higher than 1%. They aren't specified in the summary.

This agreement basically gives the biggest gains to FOs. Not sure why you're mad about that, since it sounds like you're an FO?

Originally Posted by flapshalfspeed

FO payrates are increased much more than 1%--you don't have the scale in front of you. The Exec summary didn't really make that clear.

Payraises for years 2-9 FO are much higher than 1%. They aren't specified in the summary.

This agreement basically gives the biggest gains to FOs. Not sure why you're mad about that, since it sounds like you're an FO?

Originally Posted by BeatNavy

"Broke pilots flying for a broke airline with executives making a killing, while we take inflation adjusted losses for the next 5+ years like we have the last 10+." Fixed it for you.