I hope the job opening stays on the website for a little while. I won't have my medical for a week or two.

Question for the L3 guys... how often do you start... for lack of a better term... new hire classes? Do you regularly send guys to training, or is it just a 2 or 3 times a year kind of thing?

 

There's "usually" job postings montly at all the ISR companies so if you miss this one, I wouldn't sweat it. There's a lot of pilot attrition during the holiday season amongst the ISR contractors for obvious reasons.

Training seems to be run a couple times a month as needed...

 

I see a lot of these companies fly King Air 350, that requires a type rating. So they obviously send you to get a type rating if you don't have one. My question for myself and others, does L3 and the others make you sign any agreement for any length and what happens if you leave before that time?

 

Some places like Avenge appear to have start perspective employees signing training bonds for some of their programs, and have sued guys for leaving whether they had a training contract or not. I'm sure some of those guys can chime in.

L-3 doesn't make you sign a training contract with your offer letter, and I don't think MAG does either. There are some things you have to sign, but nothing that denotes a value to your type rating and X months of required service in return for it.

Word on the street is that if you leave L-3 on good terms, they will welcome you back in the future- and there are guys who come back. I haven't heard of instances of the company going after anyone for leaving in the same way Avenge has sued former employees just for leaving (and lost in court). I don't foresee L-3 doing so in the future either. It's a Fortune 500 company so I doubt it takes it personal when people leave like some smaller companies seem to.

A while back L-3 was the only one that would pay new hires a salary while in training as well as perdiem/lodging for guys who didn't have type ratings. MAG wouldn't pay unless they came type rated in the 350... travel only until OCONUS I'm not sure if that's changed but I know a bunch of guys who went to L-3 for that reason alone. The idea of being a fully paid company employee with benefits from day one sent a message that L-3 was interested in the success of their new hires where the Avenge training contract wreaked of indentured servitude and MAGs lack of pay in training didn't give the warm fuzzy that they were confident enough in keeping their contracts to not terminate their employee group without any prior warning and at the time, Dynamic paid A LOT less than they do now also.

Definitely do your research on the companies and don't be afraid to talk to their pilot recruiters/hiring managers to get the companies official positions on things like training contracts, employment terms/pay etc. Things change often enough that the guys who work mostly downrange don't hear the latest and greatest until they get back to home base for the company sometimes.

 

You don't necessarily get a type rating from these companies. You are trained to contract requirements. Remember these are government owned airplanes being flown overseas. Military pilots aren't typed but they are trained to service specifications and thats kind of the same thing here. There are plenty of pilots with extensive experience in the King Air series who cannot legally fly a civilian version in the US. FAR's state a military pilot can go to the FAA and get their license. There is no such provision for civilians flying government equipment.

 

You haven't actually worked for any of these operators, have you?

 

Yeah, just disregard this post...

If you're hired to fly an aircraft that requires a type rating by one or the overseas ISR companies, you'll get a type rating. There are Wickets setup by the government training requirement wise to ensure contractors don't go crashing their planes left and right. These wickets differ between what government agency has what contract. It's usually type rating required and in some cases even hours in type required for specific aircraft depending on the customer requirements.

 

I flew 300s and 350s for Avenge with no type rating.

MAISR contract didn't require it.

 

Yeah, and at the other end of the spectrum- with the current contract that MAG has they get guys a type rating on the proline, and exclude the EFIS differences training at CAE, but if they have less than 300hrs on the 350, the Army won't let them fly it so they end up flying 300s with EFIS... because Potato.

Avenge and MAG both advertise they'll get pilots a type rating so it looks like somewhere along the line the government decided they wanted to require it. You've been around the industry for a while, what caused the shift from no type required to type rating required?

 

I have been with both Dynamic and MAG-DS. Good people for the most part at both companies. Regarding training/commitments; Dynamic just asks you to do 180 days downrange in your 1st year. MAG-DS pays slightly less your first 60 days down range and after that, both yours and the companies obligation to each other is satisfied.

The only guys that seem to leave this business are ones who's family's want them home more or they get much better positions elsewhere. If you leave on good terms and do a good job downrange, they will almost all want you back if you want to return at some point in the future.