Co-pilot not rated in jet
03-24-2013, 02:10 PM
#1
Get me outta here...
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Joined APC: Oct 2008
Position: Boeing right seat
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Co-pilot not rated in jet
Quick question... out of my area of knowledge.
Hawker jet needs to go on a trip this week.
Co-pilot cannot go.
If I'm not typed in the jet, can I legally occupy the right seat for the trip?
It's being flown Part 91 within the CONUS.
Hawker jet needs to go on a trip this week.
Co-pilot cannot go.
If I'm not typed in the jet, can I legally occupy the right seat for the trip?
It's being flown Part 91 within the CONUS.
03-24-2013, 02:16 PM
#3
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No, but you do need to meet the training requirements on type in FAR 61.55, including 3 take-off and landings, some OEI work and systems/procedures ground instruction. Not, just jump in and go.
GF
GF
03-24-2013, 02:22 PM
#4
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Oh boy another SIC-logging question. We specialize in those here. Rick, Wasp, and Noy are a few of our resident experts on this topic.
> Is it a single-pilot certified jet with the PIC single pilot-approved? Call out the type and model for best results.
> If it is a single-pilot certified airplane, does the PIC you are using have that particular endorsement on his type rating? Some jets can be had either or both ways. You need to ask (or look up) what status your captain is.
> Part 91 all legs, right? Part 135 is another animal.
> What does the insurance company say about it? Not the FAA law of course, but still important and often the most important thing. There may be a company- specific Part 91 OpSpec the insurance company requires.
> Is the CA an instructor of some sort?
> Is it a single-pilot certified jet with the PIC single pilot-approved? Call out the type and model for best results.
> If it is a single-pilot certified airplane, does the PIC you are using have that particular endorsement on his type rating? Some jets can be had either or both ways. You need to ask (or look up) what status your captain is.
> Part 91 all legs, right? Part 135 is another animal.
> What does the insurance company say about it? Not the FAA law of course, but still important and often the most important thing. There may be a company- specific Part 91 OpSpec the insurance company requires.
> Is the CA an instructor of some sort?
03-24-2013, 03:14 PM
#6
Chief Jeppesen Updater
Joined APC: Oct 2005
Position: Executive Transport Driver
Posts: 3,080
Originally Posted by Cubdriver
Oh boy another SIC-logging question. We specialize in those here. Rick, Wasp, and Noy are a few of our resident experts on this topic.
> Is it a single-pilot certified jet with the PIC single pilot-approved? Call out the type and model for best results.
> If it is a single-pilot certified airplane, does the PIC you are using have that particular endorsement on his type rating? Some jets can be had either or both ways. You need to ask (or look up) what status your captain is.
> Part 91 all legs, right? Part 135 is another animal.
> What does the insurance company say about it? Not the FAA law of course, but still important and often the most important thing. There may be a company- specific Part 91 OpSpec the insurance company requires.
> Is the CA an instructor of some sort?
> Is it a single-pilot certified jet with the PIC single pilot-approved? Call out the type and model for best results.
> If it is a single-pilot certified airplane, does the PIC you are using have that particular endorsement on his type rating? Some jets can be had either or both ways. You need to ask (or look up) what status your captain is.
> Part 91 all legs, right? Part 135 is another animal.
> What does the insurance company say about it? Not the FAA law of course, but still important and often the most important thing. There may be a company- specific Part 91 OpSpec the insurance company requires.
> Is the CA an instructor of some sort?
It's a question about minimum qualifications to sit in the right seat for a non-type rated FO. OP stated aircraft type is a Hawker.
Presumably this trip has passengers or cargo onboard? (As opposed to flying empty to a MX facility for an inspection?)
03-24-2013, 04:22 PM
#7
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Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 834
All that has been said is good info; however with your apparent background, Etc. You might be suprised at how simple this might be accomplished, especially being part 91; it could simply involve the CP or owner, Etc. making a quick phone call to the insurance folks and possibly the Feds. Have them send a fax or some other legal form of correspondence and you could be good to go. Speaking from experience...
Additional... It would be sad if you were otherwise given the green light but were hung up over the civilian high altitude/pressurized aircraft endorsement...
Additional... It would be sad if you were otherwise given the green light but were hung up over the civilian high altitude/pressurized aircraft endorsement...
Last edited by Yoda2; 03-24-2013 at 04:30 PM. Reason: added additional info
03-24-2013, 05:15 PM
#8
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Joined APC: Nov 2008
Position: EMB-145
Posts: 229
Originally Posted by galaxy flyer
No, but you do need to meet the training requirements on type in FAR 61.55, including 3 take-off and landings, some OEI work and systems/procedures ground instruction. Not, just jump in and go.
GF
GF
Originally Posted by Yoda2
All that has been said is good info; however with your apparent background, Etc. You might be suprised at how simple this might be accomplished, especially being part 91; it could simply involve the CP or owner, Etc. making a quick phone call to the insurance folks and possibly the Feds. Have them send a fax or some other legal form of correspondence and you could be good to go. Speaking from experience...
Additional... It would be sad if you were otherwise given the green light but were hung up over the civilian high altitude/pressurized aircraft endorsement...
Additional... It would be sad if you were otherwise given the green light but were hung up over the civilian high altitude/pressurized aircraft endorsement...
The second bolded part about a high altitude endorsement doesn't apply, as it is only required to act as PIC.
03-24-2013, 05:32 PM
#9
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Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 834
Originally Posted by hemaybedid
As galaxy flyer stated you have to meet the requirements of 61.55. That can be accomplished in a couple of hours, but carries with it the expense of operating the aircraft. Once accomplished you can have the training PIC write an endorsement and take it to the FISDO to get an SIC type on your certificate. The SIC type is NOT required for a CONUS flight however. Just a plus if you want it later on for international.
The second bolded part about a high altitude endorsement doesn't apply, as it is only required to act as PIC.
The second bolded part about a high altitude endorsement doesn't apply, as it is only required to act as PIC.
03-24-2013, 07:36 PM
#10
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Joined APC: May 2006
Position: ATP, CFI etc.
Posts: 6,056
Originally Posted by FlyerJosh
Not an SIC logging question...
It's a question about minimum qualifications to sit in the right seat for a non-type rated FO.
It's a question about minimum qualifications to sit in the right seat for a non-type rated FO.
....OP stated aircraft type is a Hawker...
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