Regional airlines want to axe 1500 hour rule
10-05-2021, 11:26 AM
#111
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Joined APC: Mar 2018
Posts: 216
Originally Posted by TiredSoul
Not to be a pain but how much do you know about “Airline training” in Europe?
https://www.pilotcareernews.com/blac...avia-training/
The MPL program mentioned in this article is 22(!) months. Then it’s right seat 737.
Thats a far cry from a Part 61 3-months Commercial then right seat Regionals.
Same number of hours.
You tell me if there’s a difference.
https://www.pilotcareernews.com/blac...avia-training/
The MPL program mentioned in this article is 22(!) months. Then it’s right seat 737.
Thats a far cry from a Part 61 3-months Commercial then right seat Regionals.
Same number of hours.
You tell me if there’s a difference.
10-05-2021, 02:58 PM
#112
New Hire
Joined APC: Dec 2019
Posts: 8
Originally Posted by TiredSoul
Not to be a pain but how much do you know about “Airline training” in Europe?
https://www.pilotcareernews.com/blac...avia-training/
The MPL program mentioned in this article is 22(!) months. Then it’s right seat 737.
Thats a far cry from a Part 61 3-months Commercial then right seat Regionals.
Same number of hours.
You tell me if there’s a difference.
https://www.pilotcareernews.com/blac...avia-training/
The MPL program mentioned in this article is 22(!) months. Then it’s right seat 737.
Thats a far cry from a Part 61 3-months Commercial then right seat Regionals.
Same number of hours.
You tell me if there’s a difference.
The washout rate is more than 50%, students pay their own training. The actual timeline is 3-4 years. A majority of students end up with several training failures and restarts. It's not pretty.
10-05-2021, 04:06 PM
#113
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Joined APC: Nov 2011
Position: Volleyball Player
Posts: 3,982
Originally Posted by SoFloFlyer
You know it’s not the same as 121. Different requirements on almost every single level. Please don’t play stupid.
10-05-2021, 05:36 PM
#114
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Joined APC: Mar 2018
Posts: 216
Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes
135 commuter air carrier is only "one level" below 121, in many cases, they run more complex operations with many more airplanes, staff, etc. There are some pretty small 121 operations out there. If you want to be grouping "airlines" though, it's best to specify, since airline and air carrier are words that can easily contain both parts, based on all the requirements they meet and the service they provide. There are lot more of these options (both small 121 and large 135) than many people know about. Yes, many 135 operators with two-crew operations/environments, FOs, etc. For the larger aircraft, many of the requirements are the same or very similar. 121 goes into more depth in most cases, but not all. If one is looking at airliner fatalities, why wouldn't we consider all scheduled operations?
10-05-2021, 09:10 PM
#115
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Joined APC: Nov 2011
Position: Volleyball Player
Posts: 3,982
Originally Posted by Wilfortina
Because they’re not at all comparable. You’re comparing piston singles to jetliners.
So my question is, why wouldn't you consider all of the air carrier fatalities for the accident rate? If you are going to limit to 121, that's fine, just say "121".
10-06-2021, 04:21 AM
#117
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Joined APC: Jul 2018
Posts: 449
The 1,500 hour rule was pretty arbitrary, but at the same time it forces new pilots to get experience flying outside of a training environment. Those hours of flying without a flight instructor next to you is where you really build your Aeronautical Decision Making, and you probably make some bad calls that you get to learn from because of the lower stakes involved. Especially since these days a new hire is likely to be a Captain within two years at a regional, I do think those extra hours really make a difference.
10-06-2021, 04:23 AM
#118
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Joined APC: Mar 2018
Posts: 216
Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes
So what kind of airplane do you have to fly to be an "airline"? Where is that written down? Many, probably over half, of the commuter (scheduled) operations are turboprop and/or multi-engine and/or multi-crew operations. The single-pilot piston stuff mainly on-demand. Air carrier is what I'm talking about.
So my question is, why wouldn't you consider all of the air carrier fatalities for the accident rate? If you are going to limit to 121, that's fine, just say "121".
So my question is, why wouldn't you consider all of the air carrier fatalities for the accident rate? If you are going to limit to 121, that's fine, just say "121".
10-06-2021, 04:29 AM
#119
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Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: Boeing 737
Posts: 4,796
Originally Posted by DocMcFly
This thread is about “Regional Airlines” and axing the “1500 Hour Rule” (which doesn’t exist for part 135). It should be self evident that we are trying to discuss only the 121 world.
Doesn't 135 still require a minimum of 1200TT? Seems like that's what I remember from my check hauling days before I could be assigned an IFR run.
10-06-2021, 06:28 AM
#120
All is fine at .79
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Position: Paahlot
Posts: 4,086
Originally Posted by Approach1260
The 1,500 hour rule was pretty arbitrary, but at the same time it forces new pilots to get experience flying outside of a training environment. Those hours of flying without a flight instructor next to you is where you really build your Aeronautical Decision Making, and you probably make some bad calls that you get to learn from because of the lower stakes involved. Especially since these days a new hire is likely to be a Captain within two years at a regional, I do think those extra hours really make a difference.
Especially since there’s no requirement for those hours to be anything but drilling holes in the sky.
I know of people that bought their own clapped out Cherokee 140 because they didn’t want to flight instruct.
Look at all the shared time building threads on this forum. Safety pilot “PIC” what a joke.
So you think another 400 hrs in your uncle’s Arrow and 400 hrs of banner towing and 400 hrs of flight instruction magically makes you the better pilot?
Let’s say 0-CFI at a 141 school then 1200 hrs of flight instruction at same school:
Designated practice area’s, assigned cross countries, canned stage checks.
1500 hrs and a ATP-ME and you’ve literally not been out of State.
That’s why a numerical threshold doesn’t mean anything.
Period.
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