boilerpilot

Oh brother.

Did you also have to walk to school both up hill both ways bare foot in the snow in 150 degree heat?

Anybody in IOE for their first job is going to be overwhelmed, I don't care if you have 200 hours or 2000 hours. It's the very nature of 121 flying compared to any other type of flying. I've seen 300 hours pilots on IOE get engine failures and perform just fine.

The fact is that if you have a IOE instructor come into IOE with your attitude, then it doesn't matter the experience level of the student (with the possible exception of prior 121 experience), you're GOING to find points to prove your point. If they haven't flown IMC, you'll talk about their inexperience, if they HAVE, then you'll talk about their lack of judgement. If they haven't had any emergencies, you'll talk about their lack of experience and naiivite, if they HAVE, you'll talk about either their lack of judgement or say that it doesn't really matter. Which is it?

Swedish Blender

What's wrong with 2000 RVR? Most places you can go to 1800 RVR with the right lights. He/she who realized they didn't have to go doesn't work for an airline. You will go with 2000 RVR.

g-code

It was above minimums and as I said I wanted to learn as much as possible. I had been to the airport before so I was comfortable with the approach. I flew the approach correctly and SAFELY. What was wrong with my ADM in that situation? Maybe I will do it inverted next time just so I can use more than one brain cell and impress you.

As I said, I am just playing by the rules as they stand now. If I have to CFI for 2000 hours thats fine. If I don't, even better.

Now forgive me if you think this next part is a little insolent in your eyes, but I was just trying to show that not all low-time guys are the same.

I work dispatch at my flight school to help pay for my training. I go through a can of Niagra starch about once every three weeks. I can see my reflection in my uniform shoes, and I wear a tie even when its not required (in the summer). I keep my hair in a high and tight with a 1 on the sides and no my hair isn't "frosted". I have had both the owner and the chief pilot tell me I have the sharpest uniform of any employee and I have been guaranteed a CFI position.

On the flip side of that coin; I cannot remember the number of guys at the majors I have seen who's uniforms are absolutely disgusting.

In fact, I non-revved on a legacy carrier back from my checkride recently and I saw the following:

1. FOs and captains so fat that their stomachs hung over their belt buckles and I thought their pants would split in the back or they might have heart failure walking from gate to gate.

2. I saw an FO rant about "ignorant" passengers because some idiot (who was a paid F) made a bad attempt at a joke. This FO was speaking loud enough for the passenger to hear about the "errors of his ways".

3. Another major pilot not only with an iPod, but an armband for it. He was drumming away on his knees and whistling while waiting for our flight to board. Once on board, he pulled out a portable DVD player and had quite a fun time watching "Wall-e". Oh, and he changed out of uniform mid-flight wearing a green shirt with his uniform pants.

4. Guys with so much dandruff on their jackets that I wanted to ski down their backs.

5. 40 year-olds with backpacks walking through the terminal.

I have also spent some time in the military and I would like to think that I have learned a thing or two about leadership. Whenever I have been put in a position of leadership I have done my damndest to lead by example and help those under me no matter the situation.

If I do end up getting hired somewhere with low time (which I probably wont) I will do my best to learn everything possible. I will ask questions and pick the captain's brain when possible so I won't be the liability you refer to.

I am sorry if you think I am apparently a dangerous pilot, but I have 5 letters of recommendation from guys I have flown with who beg to differ.

I am a consummate professional and safety is my TOP priority when I fly. Do I know everything? Of course not and I openly admit that, but I am willing and eager to learn with a humble attitude.

"If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader."
-John Q Adams

Mason32

Nope, walked or took the bus.

I never said there wasn't an overwhelming load of information to assimilate... I was saying that teaching basic airmanship to new hires is not something we have had to do with more experienced pilots.

Exactly my point. The days of doing work as a CFI, then light single then twin cargo, then 135 commuter or B1900 part 121 prior to ever seeing a jet aircraft prepared a pilot much better for the transition.


You have me confused with somebody else... I have not stated that IMC time makes somebody experienced.... in fact, I think I've stated the opposite, that in todays training environment, it is becoming an irrelevant number.

No, I spoke of the judgement of intentionally flying in extremely low weather conditions when it wasn't required to do so.... A pilot can log a ton of IMC time without ever having to push the limits. The example I cited was one of pushing the limits by a comparatively, and statistically low time pilot.

It is a fact that if you fly enough, sooner or later you will have an emergency. By the time a pilot has the PIC and total time for 135 PIC they typically have had some issue or another where they had to use ADM and make some decisions beyond when to extend flaps on the downwind.

In the case I discussed, we were talking about a person with less than 280 hours with at least four seperate emergencies in a statistically very very short time period. The implications are obvious... Perhaps a few lessons in preflight inspections and attention to detail would be in order... and if not, then the decision making involved in continuing to rent from that aircraft provider would be a good question to ask. This was in response to a single posting of one person, not a general statement of all pilots.

Mason32

For us, nothing is wrong with 2000RVR, the scenario being discussed was a current <280 hour pilot who is still building time and job hunting who went out intentionally to fly in those conditions.... IMC is IMC regardless of the ceilings. Pushing the limits for no reason is an example of poor ADM. That was the point.

His responses are as expected. My suggestion would be for him, while he is covering the desk at the flight school, to borrow a CFI FOI book and learn about dangerous attitudes and machismo. Everybody always thinks they are better than the next guy, or that it won't happen to me.... then we read and learn about and from them in NTSB reports.

How many of you have burried friends from accidents over the years?
Weren't they all excellent pilots too.....

If you want to go screw your small private plane into the dirt, be my guest, but when people in back are paying for you to make the safe decisions, check your ego's at the main cabin door.

g-code

I was on a commercial cross-country and the ceilings were lower than forecasted. I understood what the minimums were, I was familiar with the airport and approach, and there was no significant terrain around. Whats the problem?

It had nothing to do with machismo and it had everything to do with practicing for the real thing. Or should I perhaps do it for the first time in a 121 atmosphere after the captain has clocked out with 50 people in the back as you suggested?

I respect your experience but are you always this condescending?

Oskeewowow

Yes.

And btw, when the regionals do start hiring, if you go anywhere other than Eagle, Comair, or Mesaba, he will claim you to be the scourge of the earth.

Before you whip up a lengthy response Mason, understand I'm just poking some light hearted fun!

DeadHead

RJ = Retarded Juvenile

This fire's running out of fuel.

PIPErdrvr

All you have to do is look at any of mason's previous posts to find out that he will inevitably prove you to be wrong in some way. Except now he won't post a response, since I said he would...
Is it just me or does it seem like every good and informative thread is turned into a p*ssing match b/t him and all others?

Mason32

Fun is a good thing.....