So then you would get the ATP but keep the SIC type until you can upgrade?

 

Agreed. I didn't say it could NOT be done, I just said that as their are currently authorized, I don't think they can do an ATP ride by itself....

The flip side of this is, by the time they resume hiring, these newer FO's will be on third year pay, and at the very least second year pay... AMR has shown that they would rather keep a flow of new pilots on first year pay than anything else... I would not be surprised at all to watch AMR tell pilots, especially 8 year FO's with only commercial tickets, to obtain the ATP or we will be forced to let you go and replace you with a new hire.... and there will be no shortage of ATP furloughed pilots on the streets that will take ANY job they can get. It will let AMR replace what they consider "higher cost" employees with new hires who already have ATP's...

Stop thinking AMR will ever do the right thing (such as voluntarrily spending money/time that they don't think they HAVE to spend), they will always do whatever they "think" will save them money.

Interesting. I agree, this will be a sticking point

 

Age 23 will not be an issue at all. There are VERY few airline pilots who will have that problem, and congress is not going to go out of their way for a handful of votes.

Since the ATP requirement will not even take effect until three years after passage of the law, almost every young FO will be 23 when the time comes...it's possible that they would ALL be at least age 23.

The ATP requirement WILL affect future new-hires...they will not be able to skip college, go to a puppy mill, and get an immediate airline job. Oh Darn.

 

(B) ALL FLIGHT CREWMEMBERS- Rules issued under paragraph (1) shall ensure that, after the date that is 3 years after the date of enactment of this Act, all flight crewmembers--
(i) have obtained an airline transport pilot license under part 61 of title 14, Code of Federal Regulations;

The bill isn't that long, maybe folks should read it before asking or answering questions.

Search Results - THOMAS (Library of Congress)

 

Everyone has seen the "proposed" bill, but until it passes, none of the provisions are final. Just as any other bill it could be subject to rejection and/or modification, you seem to be implying that it is a done deal, it's not, hence the room for speculation on such things as the execution of a "grandfather" clause, and younger than 23 current 121 pilots.

No need to be a wise-guy about it.

 

I see no reason to spend the money for a twin. You can get an ATP in a Cessna 172. The proposed law says nothing about needing a multi-engine ATP.

Joe

 

sounds like ex post facto law to me. Under the terms of my employment I was not required to have an ATP cert, now the government requires one for me to remain employed? Hmm...

I think some people are forgetting many f'd FOs out there, that have been on the street 1.5+ years, some of whom will have difficulty ponying up for currency and checkride if they need it.

While not a bad move on the part of Congress, I think this will have little to no effect. When the next hiring wave hits, the guys that have been instructing for the last 5+ years will still walk straight from the Seminole into the right seat of the RJ. Then companies will get waivers from the FAA to hire below 1500 hrs again.

 

2 ILS (one single engine)
2 non-precision apps
V1 cut
Single engine landing
Stall and Steep turns

At least thats what I remember from my type ride

That is perhaps the scariest side effect which I am in agreement that companies will not be shy in doing so.

 

Babbitt ain't gonna require an ATP. The airline execs will fire him if he tried to do something like that. It's going to be business as usual with a few cosmetic and inconsequential changes enough to give the appearance of doing something. And Mr. Babbitt will leave the FAA in a few years for a very lucrative lobbist job for the ATA.

 

Babbitt will do whatever the Legislative and Executive Branch tell him to do through legislation...

I agree about the cross pollination of the FAA and ATA.