Malaysian 777 missing
03-27-2014, 10:42 AM
#901
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Position: B757 Ca, Retired.
Posts: 195
Originally Posted by Sorensen
03-27-2014, 10:43 AM
#902
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Posts: 204
Originally Posted by JJ21
This was in the news:
Lithium metal batteries deliver extremely high densities of energy, and if they are mishandled they can catch fire, a fire that can't be extinguished with halon, the most common kind of fire-suppression systems in passenger aircraft.
That's one reason the FAA banned shipments of nonrechargeable lithium metal batteries on passenger planes in 2004. But that ban only applies in the United States; international authorities are still considering whether to enact such a rule. Cargo and passenger aircraft are free to carry lithium ion batteries, although they are subject to labeling and packing regulations.
So what was on board Flight 370? Malaysian officials, after saying the cargo manifest would "be released in due course," later got a little more specific and said the Boeing 777 was carrying 440 pounds of lithium ion batteries. What else? Nothing that would cause a problem, the Malaysians assure us.
An Australian news media report said the Malaysian government refused to release the manifest to the Australian government, which would find such information helpful as it tries to map out a search.
Lithium metal batteries deliver extremely high densities of energy, and if they are mishandled they can catch fire, a fire that can't be extinguished with halon, the most common kind of fire-suppression systems in passenger aircraft.
That's one reason the FAA banned shipments of nonrechargeable lithium metal batteries on passenger planes in 2004. But that ban only applies in the United States; international authorities are still considering whether to enact such a rule. Cargo and passenger aircraft are free to carry lithium ion batteries, although they are subject to labeling and packing regulations.
So what was on board Flight 370? Malaysian officials, after saying the cargo manifest would "be released in due course," later got a little more specific and said the Boeing 777 was carrying 440 pounds of lithium ion batteries. What else? Nothing that would cause a problem, the Malaysians assure us.
An Australian news media report said the Malaysian government refused to release the manifest to the Australian government, which would find such information helpful as it tries to map out a search.
Google any of the Youtube demos of lithium battery fires. It isn't pretty.
You clearly prefer conspiracy theories over rational (considering the facts so far) possibilities. I think someone opened up a bag of durian fruit and everyone passed out from the stench. Or black holes swallowed it up. Or a "shadow" aircraft did something to make it disappear. Where is Tom Clancy when we need him?
03-27-2014, 01:37 PM
#903
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Position: falcon/Left
Posts: 35
LightAttack...there have been 140 aircraft incidents/accidents involving lithium batteries...not all of the planes burned and crashed. It is highly possible that the toxic fumes entered into the cabin/cockpit and incapacitated the crew/pax....it is highly possible that a fire could have breached the pressure vessel and caused a rapid decompression....what happens to a fire during a rapid decompression? What happens when a fire is exposed to outside temperatures of around -40?
Even the Australian Govt wants to know more about these batteries.
How do you find lithium batteries to be a conspiracy theory based on the incident/accident history involving aircraft? Maybe you should stop reading Tom's books.
Do I think this is the only explanation for the aircraft crash...no, but it is one possibility.
As for the plane flying for 6-7 hours....how about Payne Stewarts aircraft flying for 5 hours with the crew/pax incapacitated crashing in North Dekota when it was flying from Florida to Texas. Just look up that accident...plus many others that happened in the same way.
Seriously open your mind set.
ps the NTSB has NOT ruled out anything yet...why? Because they don't have an AIRCRAFT to piece together to find out what happened...you can bet your bottom dollar they are NOT ruling out the lithium batteries as a possible cause...unlike you.
Even the Australian Govt wants to know more about these batteries.
How do you find lithium batteries to be a conspiracy theory based on the incident/accident history involving aircraft? Maybe you should stop reading Tom's books.
Do I think this is the only explanation for the aircraft crash...no, but it is one possibility.
As for the plane flying for 6-7 hours....how about Payne Stewarts aircraft flying for 5 hours with the crew/pax incapacitated crashing in North Dekota when it was flying from Florida to Texas. Just look up that accident...plus many others that happened in the same way.
Seriously open your mind set.
ps the NTSB has NOT ruled out anything yet...why? Because they don't have an AIRCRAFT to piece together to find out what happened...you can bet your bottom dollar they are NOT ruling out the lithium batteries as a possible cause...unlike you.
03-27-2014, 02:22 PM
#905
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Position: Baja Vermont
Posts: 5,177
We're not ruling it out, it's you that ruling out the scenarios that the circumstances and the few known facts are most likely--human intervention of some sort.
If lithium batteries did breach the pressure vessel at F350, the plane would NOT fly for seven hours after comms went out in a specific sequence.
I know all too much about the Stewart accident--batteries weren't the cause. You could look up the Helios accident for depressurization, too.
GF
If lithium batteries did breach the pressure vessel at F350, the plane would NOT fly for seven hours after comms went out in a specific sequence.
I know all too much about the Stewart accident--batteries weren't the cause. You could look up the Helios accident for depressurization, too.
GF
03-27-2014, 03:05 PM
#906
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Originally Posted by F224
Those look like the bottles on a B727or DC9 to me.
03-27-2014, 04:01 PM
#907
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Posts: 639
Originally Posted by F224
Those look like the bottles on a B727or DC9 to me.
03-27-2014, 04:32 PM
#908
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Posts: 29
Precisely so the real question is why have malaysian Airlines not released maintenance records for 9M-MRO?
Was MH370 still fitted with low pressure oxygen hoses part numbers 57034-81220, 57034-81320, or 57034-91100?
Boeing Alert Service Bulletin 777-35A0027 Revision 1, dated April 19, 2012 requires replacement of low pressure oxygen hoses with non conductive low pressure hoses located in the flight deck within 18 months.
The original hose looks like this with an anti-kink spring embedded in the plastic.
Boeing Tests of used hoses found that often at either end engineers had spliced hoses into couplings with severed spring wire able to connect electrically to the rest of the aircraft through the coupling itself. In cases where this happened the hose in effect became like an electric bar heater. Findings of tests indicated when exposed to 28VAC at 5amps and temperatures over 604-620 degrees F the hose would rupture.
Those conditions might not occur for months of normal operation but in the event of electrical shorting or surges the amperage would rise sharply along with the temperature of the hose.
Was MH370 still fitted with low pressure oxygen hoses part numbers 57034-81220, 57034-81320, or 57034-91100?
Boeing Alert Service Bulletin 777-35A0027 Revision 1, dated April 19, 2012 requires replacement of low pressure oxygen hoses with non conductive low pressure hoses located in the flight deck within 18 months.
The original hose looks like this with an anti-kink spring embedded in the plastic.
Boeing Tests of used hoses found that often at either end engineers had spliced hoses into couplings with severed spring wire able to connect electrically to the rest of the aircraft through the coupling itself. In cases where this happened the hose in effect became like an electric bar heater. Findings of tests indicated when exposed to 28VAC at 5amps and temperatures over 604-620 degrees F the hose would rupture.
Those conditions might not occur for months of normal operation but in the event of electrical shorting or surges the amperage would rise sharply along with the temperature of the hose.
03-27-2014, 04:41 PM
#909
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Posts: 29
Originally Posted by Rather B Fishin
I'm assuming like most aircraft, the 777 also has a PBE in the cockpit.
And then as this cascades into a third emergency explosive decompression.
Suddenly the cockpit is a hurricane of escaping cabin air, papers flying everywhere, condensation mist, blow torch like flames, air evacuating from the lungs of pilots who have to force breath, temperature drops to minus 50, no oxygen in their masks which takes God knows how long to don... followed by confusion at not being able to get air and very, very quickly through the fog of their own confusion they become dizzy and faint and then the lights go out in the brains.
That is the reality.
03-27-2014, 04:53 PM
#910
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Posts: 639
Originally Posted by SyGunson
The issue is if both pilots were already preoccupied with an electrical failure unaware of a fire at first and more intent on turning their heavily laden plane back to Singapore or wherever, then a new emergency develops, ie fire, so now they are immediately distracted by a new emergency...
And then as this cascades into a third emergency explosive decompression.
Suddenly the cockpit is a hurricane of escaping cabin air, papers flying everywhere, condensation mist, blow torch like flames, air evacuating from the lungs of pilots who have to force breath, temperature drops to minus 50, no oxygen in their masks which takes God knows how long to don... followed by confusion at not being able to get air and very, very quickly through the fog of their own confusion they become dizzy and faint and then the lights go out in the brains.
That is the reality.
And then as this cascades into a third emergency explosive decompression.
Suddenly the cockpit is a hurricane of escaping cabin air, papers flying everywhere, condensation mist, blow torch like flames, air evacuating from the lungs of pilots who have to force breath, temperature drops to minus 50, no oxygen in their masks which takes God knows how long to don... followed by confusion at not being able to get air and very, very quickly through the fog of their own confusion they become dizzy and faint and then the lights go out in the brains.
That is the reality.
Originally Posted by SyGunson
Hi Simon self-evidently, a PPL people, come to have myself tongue lashed, thrashed and trashed by a higher class of bully. Watching the world spin from down under.
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