Spirit of NKS
09-11-2014, 03:11 PM
#8041
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: Airbus Left
Posts: 130
Originally Posted by skybolt
And to think I might have given you credit for actually being willing to have a real discussion.
Your comment about me and Herb and Goldstein shows your lack of grasp of anything of substance from that time period. JC came to town, and the four MEC members took advantage of that change to try and advance the pilots position, seven or eight months before I was anything but the last guy flying MD80's. It wasn't just Herb and Goldstein, it was both DTW Reps and both FLL reps. Reps doing the jobs they were elected to do. MEC Chairmen are not responsible for making policy nor decisions, they are administrators. MEC Chairmen only become dictators when their MEC's set them up to be dictators. You can't have it both ways, the elected reps are responsible no matter how much you want in to be otherwise. And let me remind you this, your DTW local attempted a recall of your FO rep in the fall of 2006 that was unsuccessful. UNSUCCESSFUL! That rep was pivotal in changing the SPA MEC from openly adversarial to Spirit to a working relationship, and he had enough support to withstand a recall.
You may wish for history to be remembered differently from what actually occurred, but wishing so doesn't make it so.
But at least your trying to move the group forward, we got that going for us!
Your comment about me and Herb and Goldstein shows your lack of grasp of anything of substance from that time period. JC came to town, and the four MEC members took advantage of that change to try and advance the pilots position, seven or eight months before I was anything but the last guy flying MD80's. It wasn't just Herb and Goldstein, it was both DTW Reps and both FLL reps. Reps doing the jobs they were elected to do. MEC Chairmen are not responsible for making policy nor decisions, they are administrators. MEC Chairmen only become dictators when their MEC's set them up to be dictators. You can't have it both ways, the elected reps are responsible no matter how much you want in to be otherwise. And let me remind you this, your DTW local attempted a recall of your FO rep in the fall of 2006 that was unsuccessful. UNSUCCESSFUL! That rep was pivotal in changing the SPA MEC from openly adversarial to Spirit to a working relationship, and he had enough support to withstand a recall.
You may wish for history to be remembered differently from what actually occurred, but wishing so doesn't make it so.
But at least your trying to move the group forward, we got that going for us!
You had my full support then, in the early days of JCs tenure. I knew Herb relatively well. But then the squabble started and instead of us against management, it became FLL pilots against DTW pilots. Union reps became very friendly with JC and team, too friendly for my taste.
Now that is just my perception, and many other's btw.
I remember I tried to talk to Herb about how important it was to stick together, he did not like to hear that.
Now I am worried that we again are going to possibly elect reps too concerned about their own local agenda. Are we going to end up spending most of our energy fighting each other, or are we going to stand together unified against our management?
All I have read so far from your candidates and supporters revolves around how bad and corrupt the current SPA ALPA leadership is (not much truth to that). Not much about how they plan on handling managements antics.
09-11-2014, 03:27 PM
#8042
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,857
Originally Posted by Balder
You can have a real discussion with me, as long as you are respectful, truthful and do not try to misrepresent facts.
You had my full support then, in the early days of JCs tenure. I knew Herb relatively well. But then the squabble started and instead of us against management, it became FLL pilots against DTW pilots. Union reps became very friendly with JC and team, too friendly for my taste.
Now that is just my perception, and many other's btw.
I remember I tried to talk to Herb about how important it was to stick together, he did not like to hear that.
Now I am worried that we again are going to possibly elect reps too concerned about their own local agenda. Are we going to end up spending most of our energy fighting each other, or are we going to stand together unified against our management?
All I have read so far from your candidates and supporters revolves around how bad and corrupt the current SPA ALPA leadership is (not much truth to that). Not much about how they plan on handling managements antics.
You had my full support then, in the early days of JCs tenure. I knew Herb relatively well. But then the squabble started and instead of us against management, it became FLL pilots against DTW pilots. Union reps became very friendly with JC and team, too friendly for my taste.
Now that is just my perception, and many other's btw.
I remember I tried to talk to Herb about how important it was to stick together, he did not like to hear that.
Now I am worried that we again are going to possibly elect reps too concerned about their own local agenda. Are we going to end up spending most of our energy fighting each other, or are we going to stand together unified against our management?
All I have read so far from your candidates and supporters revolves around how bad and corrupt the current SPA ALPA leadership is (not much truth to that). Not much about how they plan on handling managements antics.
Excellent post.
09-11-2014, 03:40 PM
#8043
Banned
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Posts: 285
Meatballs is right, most of you are airing to the whole industry what a bunch of JV guys you actually are. Grow up, put your big boy pants on and let's act like a union. Management is gloating over this and is salivating at the thoughts of fracturing this union. We are at a critical place in this industry with all the hiring going on and achieving a decent contract. This place will have to cough up an acceptable contract to keep pilots here and not jump ship to a legacy that offers significantly more to much of our younger pilots.
I can say that by what I have read on this forum, most of the idiots that are constantly b1tching no matter what are the one percenters that came here at a time when no one else would hire them. Your voice is small, there are many new people on this seniority list that are smart and educated that will steer this ship in the right direction. So please stop your kindergarten bully campaign and let our NC do their job.
I can say that by what I have read on this forum, most of the idiots that are constantly b1tching no matter what are the one percenters that came here at a time when no one else would hire them. Your voice is small, there are many new people on this seniority list that are smart and educated that will steer this ship in the right direction. So please stop your kindergarten bully campaign and let our NC do their job.
09-11-2014, 03:57 PM
#8044
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,857
Another nice post!! We've turn the corner!!!
Moving on!
Retirement, pay, schedules.
Moving on!
Retirement, pay, schedules.
09-11-2014, 04:00 PM
#8045
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 647
Originally Posted by Spiritman
Good luck Cole,
The document that was posted was a Fed document, not my version of accounts.
Post your exonerations for your DUI, the lack of reporting, and the rejected excuse from the NTSB.
What was posted was a document from the government of your lack of ability to be honest and transparent, when you stated that was a basis of your campaign.
If you are so transparent, post your exonerations of your DUI, youy lack of reporting it, and your rejection from the NTSB for the basis for an untimely appeal.
If not, then admit you were less than candid and truthfull.
http://www.ntsb.gov/alj/O_n_O/docs/aviation/5122.PDF
Here is this link, where is yours.
The document that was posted was a Fed document, not my version of accounts.
Post your exonerations for your DUI, the lack of reporting, and the rejected excuse from the NTSB.
What was posted was a document from the government of your lack of ability to be honest and transparent, when you stated that was a basis of your campaign.
If you are so transparent, post your exonerations of your DUI, youy lack of reporting it, and your rejection from the NTSB for the basis for an untimely appeal.
If not, then admit you were less than candid and truthfull.
http://www.ntsb.gov/alj/O_n_O/docs/aviation/5122.PDF
Here is this link, where is yours.
09-11-2014, 04:02 PM
#8046
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Airplane
Posts: 2,385
Originally Posted by A320ULCC
Meatballs is right, most of you are airing to the whole industry what a bunch of JV guys you actually are. Grow up, put your big boy pants on and let's act like a union. Management is gloating over this and is salivating at the thoughts of fracturing this union. We are at a critical place in this industry with all the hiring going on and achieving a decent contract. This place will have to cough up an acceptable contract to keep pilots here and not jump ship to a legacy that offers significantly more to much of our younger pilots.
I can say that by what I have read on this forum, most of the idiots that are constantly b1tching no matter what are the one percenters that came here at a time when no one else would hire them. Your voice is small, there are many new people on this seniority list that are smart and educated that will steer this ship in the right direction. So please stop your kindergarten bully campaign and let our NC do their job.
I can say that by what I have read on this forum, most of the idiots that are constantly b1tching no matter what are the one percenters that came here at a time when no one else would hire them. Your voice is small, there are many new people on this seniority list that are smart and educated that will steer this ship in the right direction. So please stop your kindergarten bully campaign and let our NC do their job.
09-11-2014, 04:07 PM
#8047
Banned
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Position: A320 Captain
Posts: 177
Spiritman,
I gave you the facts. I am sure a FOIA request would get you the rest of the documents, however I am not going to scan 1500 pages just to make you happy. You have crossed a legal line, I will not engage you further, I gave you a chance to backtrack on your slander and since you are a official union appointee, you have a duty to represent and not slander and libel your fellow pilots. I obviously have held other airline jobs since then, so if I was such a big liar and showed a lack of character, then most likely I would not have made it through the interviews. That is the last I will say to you.
To the other Spirit pilots on here,
I apologize that a few pilots, regardless of their position for or against can be so radical in their views and spit such hatred toward each other. I am no fan of the current MEC but I must respect the will of the membership. I intend to make honest changes with my fellow pilots in LEC077. While I may not be a fan of their ideology, if they stay in power then they must get my support along with the others during this next negotiation. Your vote decides whether you want that change, or to continue with the current status quo. I am merely running for a non-politcial position for one reason, making your union leadership transparent to hold all of us accountable. I know most of you have been to our website to see what we stand for and our commitment to you. I have never served in ALPA, nor do I aspire to ALPA leadership, I see a void, I have principles, and I want the check and balances in place. I am an outsider, as some of the naysayers have said, I also made a mistake 15 years ago in 1999 and got a DUI, (for those of you interested in the DUI story, see my previous post) so I doubt you have to worry about me jumping ship to Delta. I am invested in Spirit.
For those of you unaware of our promises to you in LEC077, here it is again.
1. Open the finances for all membership. This has been required by our bylaws, but hidden from us for over 5 years. If there is nothing to hide, then show us what has been required of you by our SPA bylaws.
2. We will go above and beyond and publish all trip drops, with a reason as to why the trip was dropped.
3. We will bring forward a resolution that mirrors the FLL resolution requiring a vote from our membership as to who is negotiating on our behalf. We want the best candidates negotiating on our future, you should be allowed to decide that. We are still early in the game, there has been no early opener, or meeting yet with the company, this is a clean slate.
Apparently the last time I got ALPA to release the financials and trip drops and made our pilots aware, I must have made some real enemies by knocking their hands out of the cookie jar. I did it before, and I will do it again, if that is what keeps your union accountable to you. Those of you that were here then saw the "volunteers" that were abusing the system, if this is not the case now, there should be no issue with publishing it. These are not trade secrets, the company authorizes all drops anyway.
As you can see, I have no problem standing up for you and putting my name on any of my correspondence. You can obviously see on this site who stands to lose if we open the door to your union for you. Please feel free to PM me or email me from our campaign site if you have any questions on my integrity or my DUI or what my intention is here at Spirit. Win or lose, I am here till retirement and I intend to support the winning candidates, however we can agree to disagree.
Cole Brantley for LEC077 Secretary Treasurer
I gave you the facts. I am sure a FOIA request would get you the rest of the documents, however I am not going to scan 1500 pages just to make you happy. You have crossed a legal line, I will not engage you further, I gave you a chance to backtrack on your slander and since you are a official union appointee, you have a duty to represent and not slander and libel your fellow pilots. I obviously have held other airline jobs since then, so if I was such a big liar and showed a lack of character, then most likely I would not have made it through the interviews. That is the last I will say to you.
To the other Spirit pilots on here,
I apologize that a few pilots, regardless of their position for or against can be so radical in their views and spit such hatred toward each other. I am no fan of the current MEC but I must respect the will of the membership. I intend to make honest changes with my fellow pilots in LEC077. While I may not be a fan of their ideology, if they stay in power then they must get my support along with the others during this next negotiation. Your vote decides whether you want that change, or to continue with the current status quo. I am merely running for a non-politcial position for one reason, making your union leadership transparent to hold all of us accountable. I know most of you have been to our website to see what we stand for and our commitment to you. I have never served in ALPA, nor do I aspire to ALPA leadership, I see a void, I have principles, and I want the check and balances in place. I am an outsider, as some of the naysayers have said, I also made a mistake 15 years ago in 1999 and got a DUI, (for those of you interested in the DUI story, see my previous post) so I doubt you have to worry about me jumping ship to Delta. I am invested in Spirit.
For those of you unaware of our promises to you in LEC077, here it is again.
1. Open the finances for all membership. This has been required by our bylaws, but hidden from us for over 5 years. If there is nothing to hide, then show us what has been required of you by our SPA bylaws.
2. We will go above and beyond and publish all trip drops, with a reason as to why the trip was dropped.
3. We will bring forward a resolution that mirrors the FLL resolution requiring a vote from our membership as to who is negotiating on our behalf. We want the best candidates negotiating on our future, you should be allowed to decide that. We are still early in the game, there has been no early opener, or meeting yet with the company, this is a clean slate.
Apparently the last time I got ALPA to release the financials and trip drops and made our pilots aware, I must have made some real enemies by knocking their hands out of the cookie jar. I did it before, and I will do it again, if that is what keeps your union accountable to you. Those of you that were here then saw the "volunteers" that were abusing the system, if this is not the case now, there should be no issue with publishing it. These are not trade secrets, the company authorizes all drops anyway.
As you can see, I have no problem standing up for you and putting my name on any of my correspondence. You can obviously see on this site who stands to lose if we open the door to your union for you. Please feel free to PM me or email me from our campaign site if you have any questions on my integrity or my DUI or what my intention is here at Spirit. Win or lose, I am here till retirement and I intend to support the winning candidates, however we can agree to disagree.
Cole Brantley for LEC077 Secretary Treasurer
Last edited by Audi2000; 09-11-2014 at 04:24 PM. Reason: misspell
09-11-2014, 04:35 PM
#8048
New Hire
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 6
Cole,
Not 1500 pages, just the ones that you were exonnerated from the NTSB issues, DUI, Failure to disclose on your medical, and your excuse that the NTSB rejected in the following letter.
http://www.ntsb.gov/alj/O_n_O/docs/aviation/5122.PDF
Answer, and it will go away.
Litigate if you feel like it. Good luck.
Think about it --- Justa tip.
Not 1500 pages, just the ones that you were exonnerated from the NTSB issues, DUI, Failure to disclose on your medical, and your excuse that the NTSB rejected in the following letter.
http://www.ntsb.gov/alj/O_n_O/docs/aviation/5122.PDF
Answer, and it will go away.
Litigate if you feel like it. Good luck.
Think about it --- Justa tip.
09-11-2014, 04:46 PM
#8049
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: Airbus Left
Posts: 130
Originally Posted by A320ULCC
Meatballs is right, most of you are airing to the whole industry what a bunch of JV guys you actually are. Grow up, put your big boy pants on and let's act like a union. Management is gloating over this and is salivating at the thoughts of fracturing this union. We are at a critical place in this industry with all the hiring going on and achieving a decent contract. This place will have to cough up an acceptable contract to keep pilots here and not jump ship to a legacy that offers significantly more to much of our younger pilots.
I can say that by what I have read on this forum, most of the idiots that are constantly b1tching no matter what are the one percenters that came here at a time when no one else would hire them. Your voice is small, there are many new people on this seniority list that are smart and educated that will steer this ship in the right direction. So please stop your kindergarten bully campaign and let our NC do their job.
I can say that by what I have read on this forum, most of the idiots that are constantly b1tching no matter what are the one percenters that came here at a time when no one else would hire them. Your voice is small, there are many new people on this seniority list that are smart and educated that will steer this ship in the right direction. So please stop your kindergarten bully campaign and let our NC do their job.
09-11-2014, 06:14 PM
#8050
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Posts: 758
Originally Posted by Balder
You can have a real discussion with me, as long as you are respectful, truthful and do not try to misrepresent facts.
You had my full support then, in the early days of JCs tenure. I knew Herb relatively well. But then the squabble started and instead of us against management, it became FLL pilots against DTW pilots. Union reps became very friendly with JC and team, too friendly for my taste.
Now that is just my perception, and many other's btw.
I remember I tried to talk to Herb about how important it was to stick together, he did not like to hear that.
Now I am worried that we again are going to possibly elect reps too concerned about their own local agenda. Are we going to end up spending most of our energy fighting each other, or are we going to stand together unified against our management?
All I have read so far from your candidates and supporters revolves around how bad and corrupt the current SPA ALPA leadership is (not much truth to that). Not much about how they plan on handling managements antics.
You had my full support then, in the early days of JCs tenure. I knew Herb relatively well. But then the squabble started and instead of us against management, it became FLL pilots against DTW pilots. Union reps became very friendly with JC and team, too friendly for my taste.
Now that is just my perception, and many other's btw.
I remember I tried to talk to Herb about how important it was to stick together, he did not like to hear that.
Now I am worried that we again are going to possibly elect reps too concerned about their own local agenda. Are we going to end up spending most of our energy fighting each other, or are we going to stand together unified against our management?
All I have read so far from your candidates and supporters revolves around how bad and corrupt the current SPA ALPA leadership is (not much truth to that). Not much about how they plan on handling managements antics.
On to the topics at hand:
1.I didn't have your full support during the early days of JC's tenure because I had no role in union leadership at that time.
2. The squabble started when the DTW local recalled their FO rep on the specific charge of "voting to often with FLL"
Speaking of that recall effort, that failed recall effort. You're worried now that we might elect reps who are "concerned about their own local agenda". You're worried now that we are spending our energy fighting each other instead of standing unified against management. Where was that concern for unification when the DTW local attempted to recall their own FO rep "because he voted to often with FLL". Maybe that FO rep (RM) was thinking of the overall pilot group vs his own "local" agenda, maybe? Did you vote to recall that famous night in DTW? Only two stood against the recall, were you one of those? Did you lecture your DTW brothers on the need to fight management vs each other.
If I may be so bold, I'll tell you the problem you're having today. You guys think that the only problem you have is a couple of loudmouths like me who won't let go of the past. WRONG! I didn't elect Connors and Leonard in FLL, and I didn't pass resolutions in FLL demanding that the Negotiators get the ax. But you still want to focus on the past. I declined to run for office this time around partially because I think that the next generation needs to step up and move us away from the DTW vs FLL mentality. You guys should step back and accept some new blood instead of trying to smear anyone not on your team who tries to step up. I'm seriously telling you this: me and Herb and Rich and Bob are not the reason so many people want new blood in office. It's up to you to understand why FLL and now DFW are in revolt.
Lemonade, You are correct Sir! Thanks for bringing me back to ground.
Ooops. Not finished yet! Balder, why is the assumption always that it is bad when union reps get friendly with management?
When union reps use their relationship with management to do the pilots business, to advance the pilot groups position, to protect the careers of individual pilots; those reps are accomplishing the job they were elected to do.
If you accept that the union must always be in conflict with management, you are accepting the very same environment you would seem to argue against. On one hand your side cusses management for being disagreeable/dishonest/etc and on the other hand you cuss union reps who manage to find a way to avoid that disagreeable/dishonesty relationship. You've set up a no win situation for the union. If the voters demand reps who go toe to toe with management, then the reps will have to be confrontational to management or face the wrath of the voters. If you don't allow your reps the ability to "play nice" with management, you've cut yourself off at the knees.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
