SonicFlyer

Yes, having a majority opinion means nothing. Why should the majority get to tell everyone else what to do?

Precisely the groupthink collectivist mentality I was referring to.




And that is patently theft. If someone wants to opt out, it shouldn't cost them anything.

SonicFlyer

Not necessarily. It depends on market forces.

The unions allow the regionals to pay crap wages for decades. Now the market is forcing the regionals to step up their pay significantly.

Bozo the pilot

I love the market economy dictating higher wages, but in some industry, we NEED unions.
Aviation is one of them.
Think of the achievements of ALPA. I know it can be challenging dealing with them, but QOL for pilots would not be where it is with out them.
I understand your reluctance to embrace the "group" mentality, and its why each CBA ends up falling on mixed reviews.

GogglesPisano

I think paying 2% for an 18% raise every four years is a bargain. Without that 2% we'd be raked over the coals.

SonicFlyer: I know you're an uber-libertarian and all but here's some questions:

1) Are you an airline pilot?

2)Have you ever worked for a non-union airline?

And one more ...

3) Why do you think legacy pilots (and FDX/UPS/SWA) make what they do? If you say "market forces", then why don't non-union/corporate positions pay the same?

METO Guido

Setting aside the non-mainstream players for a moment, hammering out contract language every 5 years or so is how it's done. Does the SC's above ruling foretell dire change for transportation workers? Doubt it. Relentless market incursions from off-shore, multinational poachers? Oh yeah. But then again, I'm a libertarian.

Slaphappy

Public sector unions shouldn't even be allowed to exist. Government Workers shouldn't be allowed to organize.

It's one of the reasons states are going bankrupt paying pensions to these people who only have to work 20-25 years. The worst are cops.

Slaphappy

I feel its wrong especially when it's protesting a debunked lie.

av8or

https://bizjetjobs.com/pilot-salary-survey-captain-usa/

The average CAPTAIN pay for flying a Phenom 300 in the private/non union sector is $74k. The high side for a Penom 300 Captain is $89k. Prob varying degrees of bennies and work rules.

At NetJets, which is a union pilot group, 1st year pay, as a First Officer flying a Phenom 300 is $70-$80k, depending on your CHOSEN schedule. Second year, $85-90k. Tack on about a $20k/yr benefits package that includes 100% company paid health insurance and first year total compensation, as a FIRST OFFICER is $90-100k. A Phenom 300 CAPTAIN at NetJets is paid, depending on schedule around $200k a year... plus benefits.

Find me a non-union Captain flying a Phenom 300, or a Citation Encore, or Excel, or Citation 10, or Hawker, or Latitude, making $200k a year with company paid insurance, and I’ll kiss your ass.

There are 10,000 member companies in the NBAA. There’s one NetJets. 10 thousand companies, all competing against each other for pilots to find that ONE non-union pilot that has the pay and benefits that match a NetJets pilot.

Good luck with that. 😎

av8or

Agree 100%

FlyyGuyy

Read a few bizarre stories about fire fighters working the system near the end of their careers to change what their pension pay will be. It's absurd.