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Originally Posted by TripleSpool
(Post 2801079)
...
No amount of validation, company pride or whatever else we can conjure up will justify these hiring practices to me. We all see how incredibly corrupt it really is and I only hope for the sake of future candidates that something changes. |
Originally Posted by Brahma Fear
(Post 2800859)
If you love United so much why are you posting here. Go away.
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Originally Posted by texaspropguy
(Post 2801108)
...and for all our comrades still at the regionals that rode out the zero-career-progress years of 2008-2013, where increasing the retirement age to 65 and a the W-shaped recession took 7 years away, and now they are being bypassed due to cherry-picking and the appearance of diversification based hiring (disclaimer: I’m not actually confirming that is what is happening though).
Not far enough back, many of us had to start that point at the events of 2001. So it's a tad more than 7 years. |
Originally Posted by TripleSpool
(Post 2801079)
Diversity is neither the point nor the argument. I love diverse cities, companies, and consider myself to be diverse, as well. We are a diverse nation, after all –a nation of immigrants.
Here is the point in case some of you missed it: Flight Time Requirements (but not for you) • A minimum of 1,500 hours of total time • A minimum of 1,000 hours of fixed wing turbine time • A minimum of 100 hours of complex flight time within the last 12 months These requirements by their very nature were designed to get those who really couldn’t get hired otherwise to slip through that little crack in the door that is open to the chosen few. Whether those are members of family or a special interest group that can be used in their new marketing maneuver is entirely up to United HR to make the call. The bottom line is that their algorithm is discriminatory but not in the way of experience or education or anything else. It’s discriminatory because too often it overlooks perfectly eligible candidates in favor of less experienced ones by the stroke of a button; hence, a supposed algorithm is overrode once again by a fallible human-) So next time you talk to a consulting firm or anyone purvey to The Game, and you share your experience, expect suggestions of: more Job Fairs, more leadership in your resume, more volunteer work, maybe a different company, more PIC Turbine, more flight time in the last year….etc. All the while, an individual with no PIC Turbine (0) and fewer than 3000 hours is sitting in initial after having attended zero job fairs. No amount of validation, company pride or whatever else we can conjure up will justify these hiring practices to me. We all see how incredibly corrupt it really is and I only hope for the sake of future candidates that something changes. |
Originally Posted by ERAUAV8TR
(Post 2801154)
This will be the scandal on the news!
: to degrade with unsound principles or moral values : characterized by improper conduct : behaving in a bad or improper way But the shoe still fits;-) |
Originally Posted by RJCaptin
(Post 2801109)
Whats the matter, you dont like the truth snowflake?
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Originally Posted by Brahma Fear
(Post 2801265)
I just don’t like trolls. Now please go away.
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Originally Posted by SmoothLanderJ
(Post 2800970)
And, we've hired pilot's who aren't "diverse" who fit that description as well, PLENTY of them according to my friends on the hiring board. So do they get the same criticism from you or not?
They would indeed get criticism if they let a lesser qualified candidate cut in line in front of a more qualified candidate. it's time to give "diversity" a break already. Diversity is code "acceptable forms of discrimination." |
Originally Posted by baseball
(Post 2800647)
That's pretty typical. Expect young females and others checking the diversity box with lower credentials to get hired before a white male with double the flight time and experience.
Originally Posted by prex8390
(Post 2800536)
My regional sent twin sisters with 2000 TT about a month ago. I guess their dad who’s a pilot knows someone.
Almost everyone I know that’s been hired with “less than average” quals has been a young women
Originally Posted by RJCaptin
(Post 2800691)
What are you going to expect from a company that was brought to its knees by a 5 foot man with a criminal history.
Originally Posted by baseball
(Post 2800652)
I have seen at least 2 pilots with less than what I would consider "competitive flight time and experience" be hired at UAL. Those two pilots were low on experience but high on diversity. Other groups not in the diversity column were discriminated upon. You can pick the genre or fill in the blank. No one cares any more. It's all talk...blah blah blah.
Originally Posted by ItnStln
(Post 2798022)
It’s not reverse discrimination, it’s discrimination. Discriminating against a white person is the same as discriminating against a person of any other race.
Before I left for another job, I was a hiring manager for at&t. We were directed who to interview based on how ranked the applicants. The majority of an applicant’s ranking pertained to how they answered the demographic questions. I was once hiring an assistant store manager and had to go through ten applicants before I found one who had management and sales experience. So it was a waste of time filtering through applicants who were ranked high because of their demographics, but had no management or sales experience.
Originally Posted by Learflyer
(Post 2798003)
Some of us guys with actual experience are sick of hearing that horse $hit...so....don’t.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Holy MAGA. Show me one new hire class photo from the last 20 years with more than 10% minority hiring and I will be quiet. I am a 50 year old white hetero sexual male, 10K hours, 5 type ratings, zero failures, who had his resume walked in by an united A320 chief pilot who used to be charge of hiring, and had 10 LORs from UAL pilots. Never got an interview. Checked out the competition, guess what, it turns out they are still filling classes with white guys, just like they have been doing for the last 50 years. |
Originally Posted by symbian simian
(Post 2801452)
Holy MAGA.
Show me one new hire class photo from the last 20 years with more than 10% minority hiring and I will be quiet. I am a 50 year old white hetero sexual male, 10K hours, 5 type ratings, zero failures, who had his resume walked in by an united A320 chief pilot who used to be charge of hiring, and had 10 LORs from UAL pilots. Never got an interview. Checked out the competition, guess what, it turns out they are still filling classes with white guys, just like they have been doing for the last 50 years. There’s always going to be more white males. Nobody ever argued that. Doesn’t take away from the preferential hiring. And yeah. MAGA baby. |
Originally Posted by prex8390
(Post 2800536)
My regional sent twin sisters with 2000 TT about a month ago. I guess their dad who’s a pilot knows someone.
Almost everyone I know that’s been hired with “less than average” quals has been a young women Yes, we have women pilots and yes we have non-white dudes here...if you’re not getting called - well, maybe a little look in the mirror will help you figure out why....(trust me - it’s not because you b!tch on here about being unqualified or non worthy) |
Originally Posted by BAe3100FO
(Post 2801474)
Well if you’re soo In the know....you’d also have access to the Newhire pictures that show 40+ out of 45 ~ 48 to be white males...
Yes, we have women pilots and yes we have non-white dudes here...if you’re not getting called - well, maybe a little look in the mirror will help you figure out why....(trust me - it’s not because you b!tch on here about being unqualified or non worthy) |
How quickly this post got derailed from a sincere and valid concern about hiring practices to race and gender-baiting.
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Originally Posted by TripleSpool
(Post 2802220)
How quickly this post got derailed from a sincere and valid concern about hiring practices to race and gender-baiting.
As far as everything else, life isn't fair. I learned that as a toddler. At the end of the day, all this is only a job. If you get stuck at a regional or if it takes you 20 years to get the interview....on your death bed none of it will matter. It's only a company and its only money. Wake up and smell the roses. |
Originally Posted by Fourpaw
(Post 2802237)
Yeah sorry I asked... Some of us genuinely just want to keep working towards the end game.
As far as everything else, life isn't fair. I learned that as a toddler. At the end of the day, all this is only a job. If you get stuck at a regional or if it takes you 20 years to get the interview....on your death bed none of it will matter. It's only a company and its only money. Wake up and smell the roses. |
Originally Posted by Fourpaw
(Post 2802237)
Yeah sorry I asked... Some of us genuinely just want to keep working towards the end game.
As far as everything else, life isn't fair. I learned that as a toddler. At the end of the day, all this is only a job. If you get stuck at a regional or if it takes you 20 years to get the interview....on your death bed none of it will matter. It's only a company and its only money. Wake up and smell the roses. |
United Airlines September Job Fair
Originally Posted by BAe3100FO
(Post 2801474)
Well if you’re soo In the know....you’d also have access to the Newhire pictures that show 40+ out of 45 ~ 48 to be white males...
Sure, but that doesn’t explain why. Here’s the breakdown of most newhire classes at the legacies: 50% military—overwhelmingly white males. 30% flow-throughs—also overwhelmingly white males, reflective of the demographics of most regional pilot groups those flow-through agreements are drawing from. That leaves the remaining 20% — the “street hires”—to balance out a company’s hiring diversity, lest the be sued for discriminatory hiring practices. Which means women and minorities are going to make up the bulk of those street hires to offset the overwhelming white maleness of the other 80%. Accordingly, white male pilots at regionals without flow-through agreements are at a distinct disadvantage when competing for that last 20% of available class seats. THAT’S what people are complaining about. |
Originally Posted by TripleSpool
(Post 2798039)
Your post reminds me of one point I forgot to add to my own:
- Race, ethnicity, and gender questions should also be taken off the app. I know the option to 'not disclose' is there but we all know that it is part of the 'conjured algorithm'. Sometimes in an effort to become the most inclusive and diverse company (mostly for marketing purposes) a company will end up hiring far less experienced candidates over the more qualified ones. This is why my suggestions wouldn't work at a place like United because it would not allow for discrmination of any kind. I'm sure someone will misconstrue my point... |
Originally Posted by baseball
(Post 2801384)
it's time to give "diversity" a break already. Diversity is code "acceptable forms of discrimination."
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Originally Posted by ItnStln
(Post 2802826)
There are no acceptable forms of discrimination.
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Does the virtual job fairs count as “contact with a recruiter” for the United addendum?
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Driving History
Hi Folks,
Sorry to asking this question here, but I could not find a thread on the topic relating to the driving record section in airlineapps. I was curious what I should put for the only ticket I have even gotten, touch wood. In 2009 I got a speeding ticket. I do not remember the date exactly, but it was probably around September 2009. Anyway, I went to court, pleaded no contest, and completed the defensive driving course. Doing this apparently dismissed the ticket. Do I still need to report this in the driving history section. Like I said, I cannot remember the exact date. What do I enter for disposition? Thanks y'all. |
People be on here complaining they can’t get a job..
Job fair? NO, it’s stupid that I have to go to a gay, woman or black pilot sponsored event. Volunteer Experience? Why would I do this, I’m a pilot. Training department experience? I’m a line captain, I shouldn’t have to do any thing extra. Professional resume review? No, I shouldn’t have to pay money for that. Experience? I got 8000 hours and multiple types, this is why I should be hired above everyone else. Person that got hired... Job fair? Yes, I met with the recruiters and made a positive first impression, not only that while talking to random people I struck up a conversation with the hiring manager we talked for a while without me even realizing who it was leaving a positive impression. Volunteer experience? Yes I volunteer at the homeless shelter with my significant other and kids which allows me to spend quality time with my family while helping those that are less fortunate. Professional resume review? Yes, they corrected several common errors and things I overlooked. Training department? Yes, even though I am relatively new to the airline world I volunteered to start instructing new hires in the procedure trainers. Experience? 2500 hours with one type. Which one do you think the airline will hire? The guy/girl that “played the game” or the one who thinks playing the game is stupid? |
Originally Posted by VASBYT
(Post 2804112)
Hi Folks,
Sorry to asking this question here, but I could not find a thread on the topic relating to the driving record section in airlineapps. I was curious what I should put for the only ticket I have even gotten, touch wood. In 2009 I got a speeding ticket. I do not remember the date exactly, but it was probably around September 2009. Anyway, I went to court, pleaded no contest, and completed the defensive driving course. Doing this apparently dismissed the ticket. Do I still need to report this in the driving history section. Like I said, I cannot remember the exact date. What do I enter for disposition? Thanks y'all. If the app asks for have you EVER xyz I'd err on the side of putting it down. IE Phoenix, AZ Sep 2009. Speeding +5. Dismissed. I'd rather be somewhat accurate than lie by omission. If they question you in the interview you can explain. "I went to traffic school and did not get any points, I can't recall if it was dismissed or deferred etc. But I got caught running a stop sign, on accident and wanted to be forthcoming..." Also, I would NOT NOT NOT count on trusting a DMV request or private, online background check to clear your name or ignore past issues, but if your ticket comes up you can probably use what appears on there as an accurate accounting... |
I listed a ticket that I know I had, but was not showing in the DMV report I ordered. Never heard a peep about it in the entire process. You’re not going to lose the job over a speeding ticket. But you will lose it over dishonesty, as perceived by the company, whether intentional on your part or an oversight.
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Originally Posted by tonsterboy5
(Post 2804136)
People be on here complaining...
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Originally Posted by tonsterboy5
(Post 2804136)
People be on here complaining they can’t get a job..
Job fair? NO, it’s stupid that I have to go to a gay, woman or black pilot sponsored event. Volunteer Experience? Why would I do this, I’m a pilot. Training department experience? I’m a line captain, I shouldn’t have to do any thing extra. Professional resume review? No, I shouldn’t have to pay money for that. Experience? I got 8000 hours and multiple types, this is why I should be hired above everyone else. Person that got hired... Job fair? Yes, I met with the recruiters and made a positive first impression, not only that while talking to random people I struck up a conversation with the hiring manager we talked for a while without me even realizing who it was leaving a positive impression. Volunteer experience? Yes I volunteer at the homeless shelter with my significant other and kids which allows me to spend quality time with my family while helping those that are less fortunate. Professional resume review? Yes, they corrected several common errors and things I overlooked. Training department? Yes, even though I am relatively new to the airline world I volunteered to start instructing new hires in the procedure trainers. Experience? 2500 hours with one type. Which one do you think the airline will hire? The guy/girl that “played the game” or the one who thinks playing the game is stupid? |
Originally Posted by tonsterboy5
(Post 2804136)
People be on here complaining they can’t get a job..
Job fair? NO, it’s stupid that I have to go to a gay, woman or black pilot sponsored event. Volunteer Experience? Why would I do this, I’m a pilot. Training department experience? I’m a line captain, I shouldn’t have to do any thing extra. Professional resume review? No, I shouldn’t have to pay money for that. Experience? I got 8000 hours and multiple types, this is why I should be hired above everyone else. Person that got hired... Job fair? Yes, I met with the recruiters and made a positive first impression, not only that while talking to random people I struck up a conversation with the hiring manager we talked for a while without me even realizing who it was leaving a positive impression. Volunteer experience? Yes I volunteer at the homeless shelter with my significant other and kids which allows me to spend quality time with my family while helping those that are less fortunate. Professional resume review? Yes, they corrected several common errors and things I overlooked. Training department? Yes, even though I am relatively new to the airline world I volunteered to start instructing new hires in the procedure trainers. Experience? 2500 hours with one type. Which one do you think the airline will hire? The guy/girl that “played the game” or the one who thinks playing the game is stupid? |
Originally Posted by VASBYT
(Post 2804112)
Hi Folks,
Sorry to asking this question here, but I could not find a thread on the topic relating to the driving record section in airlineapps. I was curious what I should put for the only ticket I have even gotten, touch wood. In 2009 I got a speeding ticket. I do not remember the date exactly, but it was probably around September 2009. Anyway, I went to court, pleaded no contest, and completed the defensive driving course. Doing this apparently dismissed the ticket. Do I still need to report this in the driving history section. Like I said, I cannot remember the exact date. What do I enter for disposition? Thanks y'all. |
Originally Posted by prex8390
(Post 2804257)
The long story short. If the ticket appears dismissed, you went to court, did traffic school, it happened in 1992. Just list it. I’ve heard a lot of people don’t even get asked about them anymore. Everyone has a few. Just add in the notes it happened circa September 2009, or when they ask if you have anything else to Say regarding your application, just point out “hey this ticket right here, not exactly sure when it happened, but it happened so I listed it to the best of my knowledge, i was pulled over in XYZ city around This time for this reason, just for the life of me don’t know the date, I went to traffic school and it made it hard to find it in my records.”
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Originally Posted by MiLa
(Post 2804272)
This... absolutely list it. They really don’t care about one ticket 10 years ago. What they do care about is honesty and you would never want to make it look like you were trying to hide something over a technicality.
Thanks for the feedback. I have listed it. |
It's better to fess up and own up, than to be removed from TK because something was found on your background check that you didn't list.
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Originally Posted by RJCaptin
(Post 2800761)
They invited the top 1% of their application stack, then turned their backs on some of them by hiring people less qualified. Meanwhile, their CEO steals sand and a little asian man causes them to loose 10% of their market cap in a single day.
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Originally Posted by Fourpaw
(Post 2805830)
So for those of us that went to the expo but haven’t heard back....are we now say....top 5%, 10%.....do I hear 15%....going once going twice...:eek:
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Originally Posted by Squallrider
(Post 2806239)
Ha at this point I think we are outta luck
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Originally Posted by Fourpaw
(Post 2805830)
So for those of us that went to the expo but haven’t heard back....are we now say....top 5%, 10%.....do I hear 15%....going once going twice...:eek:
But let's be hopeful that we get invited to the next Hiring Expo this coming September... |
Originally Posted by Grumpyaviator
(Post 2806449)
Did the expo day one, failed the Hogan 4/8. Don’t know if the Hogan invite was a result of the job fair.
Do you mind sharing the exact email address United used to send the Hogan invite? Part of me still in denial and wants to check in the Junk mail file :rolleyes: |
Originally Posted by tonsterboy5
(Post 2804136)
People be on here complaining they can’t get a job..
....or the one who thinks playing the game is stupid? |
Originally Posted by Grumpyaviator
(Post 2806449)
Did the expo day one, failed the Hogan 4/8. Don’t know if the Hogan invite was a result of the job fair.
Any psych major can tell you that these tests are ineffective in revealing a pilot's true mental health. Why? Because people are smart. Aside from the obvious 'serial killer questions', to which everyone is purvey, they neither prove nor disprove anything. As a supporting side-note to my argument, Lubitz -the Germanwings pilot, passed his psych evaluation and was totally calm and collected when he locked his partner out of the cockpit and aimed toward the Alps. |
Originally Posted by tonsterboy5
(Post 2804136)
People be on here complaining they can’t get a job..
Job fair? NO, it’s stupid that I have to go to a gay, woman or black pilot sponsored event. Volunteer Experience? Why would I do this, I’m a pilot. Training department experience? I’m a line captain, I shouldn’t have to do any thing extra. Professional resume review? No, I shouldn’t have to pay money for that. Experience? I got 8000 hours and multiple types, this is why I should be hired above everyone else. Person that got hired... Job fair? Yes, I met with the recruiters and made a positive first impression, not only that while talking to random people I struck up a conversation with the hiring manager we talked for a while without me even realizing who it was leaving a positive impression. Volunteer experience? Yes I volunteer at the homeless shelter with my significant other and kids which allows me to spend quality time with my family while helping those that are less fortunate. Professional resume review? Yes, they corrected several common errors and things I overlooked. Training department? Yes, even though I am relatively new to the airline world I volunteered to start instructing new hires in the procedure trainers. Experience? 2500 hours with one type. Which one do you think the airline will hire? The guy/girl that “played the game” or the one who thinks playing the game is stupid? |
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