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06-14-2020 | 06:10 PM
#91
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 558
Likes: 6
None of the of 147 CAL furloughees went ahead of any UAL pilots that weren't furloughed also.
06-14-2020 | 07:24 PM
#94
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 491
Likes: 0
What about UAL 1998 hires that were never furloughed and placed with CAL 2005 hires? Those 7 years didn’t count for anything. Its okay because with it taking 20 years to hold Captain based on this displacement, if we merger with another carrier, there are going to be a lot of BrandX pilots hired in 2013 at their carrier placed ahead of CAL 2005 hires (who are now guppy FOs) since they can’t hold Captain. Then they will see how much their longevity matters in mergers.
06-14-2020 | 07:28 PM
#95
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 491
Likes: 0
To answer your question, there were CAL pilots who were furloughed from 2001-2004 who were placed ahead of UAL 1997 and 1998 hires who were never furloughed at UAL. The pilots from CAL and UAL who were on furlough when the merger closed were all feathered together at the bottom of the list, except for the more senior UAL furloughees with 8+ years longevity placed with CAL pilots with about 4 years longevity.
06-15-2020 | 12:38 PM
#97
On Reserve
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 77
Likes: 0
From: If it ain't Boeing I ain't going....756 Capt
ugh, can we please give this a rest? UAL hire March 2000. Furloughed twice. Career expectation, retire around 700. last 5 years <3000. Wide body Capt. Now, retire just under 2300, break 3000 just before last year(bye-bye WB Capt). Career expectation used to be a big thing in SLIs too. I am not complaining. I had 0 control over it so don't get my blood pressure up. I think BOTH airlines are better off merged than separate. I also think I am having a better career too. Most are. More bases to choose from, more airplanes, heck of a lot more locations to fly to, better work rules, nicer hotels, premium time, no cap/bank, better pay (almost back to Contract 2000 pay), the list goes on. Please let it go. Unless you are senior to me. Then, let it eat you up, give you stress issues and you have to leave 
Rant over.
Rant over.
06-15-2020 | 02:24 PM
#98
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 175
Likes: 0
From: Cub Cap
ugh, can we please give this a rest? UAL hire March 2000. Furloughed twice. Career expectation, retire around 700. last 5 years <3000. Wide body Capt. Now, retire just under 2300, break 3000 just before last year(bye-bye WB Capt). Career expectation used to be a big thing in SLIs too. I am not complaining. I had 0 control over it so don't get my blood pressure up. I think BOTH airlines are better off merged than separate. I also think I am having a better career too. Most are. More bases to choose from, more airplanes, heck of a lot more locations to fly to, better work rules, nicer hotels, premium time, no cap/bank, better pay (almost back to Contract 2000 pay), the list goes on. Please let it go. Unless you are senior to me. Then, let it eat you up, give you stress issues and you have to leave Rant over.
Rant over.ALPA merger policy between two ALPA pilot groups is only a goal for the respective merger committees. It is written by a BOD committee and becomes a "policy." There is no date of hire, longevity, career expectation, feathering, or fences involved. Just what is on the minds of the policy makers at a particular BOD meeting and it changes frequently. The respective committees can agree to anything they think is reasonable but is also subject to court challenge. They rarely agree anyway and this is one reason that most SLI's go to an arbitrator who is practically bulletproof.
So, what is the arbitrators guidelines? "fair and equitable as he sees it."
Arbitrators have a track record that can be reviewed before they are selected, as do the merger attorneys. These choices are no small matter.
06-15-2020 | 08:05 PM
#99
Banned
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 55
Likes: 0
ReadOnly, You are correct. It has NOTHING to do with anything. The fact that I was furloughed by United should in no way be used as some justification for someone saying I should have been "stapled" below CAL pilots who were hired EIGHT years AFTER I was hired by UAL. I thought I was totally over the "civil war" ****** but some folks here are (pun intended) tearing off the scab. I have flown with many excellent LCAL pilots (flew out of EWR for 1.5 yrs on the 757). I believe that if you are a doosh, you're a doosh, if you're not, you're not. Doesn't matter what legacy carrier you came from, if you were military or GA, if you were Army, or Navy, or USAF or whatever. If you're a tool, you're a tool. And I'm def calling out AirMic and Whaler as falling into the tool category. It is the most ignorant argument in the history of commercial aviation to argue that a non furloughed cal pilot should automatically be senior to a furloughed LUAL pilot. A ridiculous thing to say, yet there are many who say it. I will hazard to guess (and only calling out the tools here, I don't want to incite another round of the Civil War) that these individuals have a rejection letter from United. When I was applying, I applied to ever swinging Richard out there, but i wasn't going to stop until I got to either United, American or Delta. Who the hell chooses CAL when they have two letters in their hand (one from CAL and one from UAL). Get real. Just sayin'. Peace out.
And now everybody on this forum understands the arrogance of Legacy United “Brain Surgeons”. For the folks that haven’t lived it, this is how legacy united pilots think. Everybody who doesn’t think United is the best was “rejected” by United. You would have to have been retarded to choose United over CAL in the ‘05-‘07 timeframe. United was headed towards a third furlough and bankruptcy. Look at the SEC filings.
They were lucky that Continental bought them. “On March 31, 2013, United merged with and into Continental, with Continentalcontinuing as the surviving corporation of the Merger and as a wholly-owned subsidiary of UAL.”
On the off chance you are not familiar with why Legacy United has the industry moniker of “Brain Surgeon”, it’s because they bestowed this upon themselves. During the attempted acquisition of Frontier in 1986, the United MEC started that United pilots were “Brain Surgeons” while the Frontier pilots were merely “General Practitioners”. Nothing has changed since then. There was even a Legacy United Pilot given a 30 day unpaid holiday for screaming “SCAB” at an ‘05 hire Legacy Continental pilot in IAD. This Brain surgeon was so outrageous that he screamed this repeatedly and long enough on the train and then up the escalator that the Captain was able to call the FODM. The rant was caught on a recorded line! Lol! The ‘05 hire was not a scab btw. The LUAL furlough surgeon was simply upset that he didn’t become a narrow body captain straight from cashier at Walmart.
*sniff*
Last edited by AirMicronesia; 06-15-2020 at 08:15 PM.
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