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05-25-2015, 05:54 PM
#201
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2013
Posts: 2,159
Originally Posted by gettinbumped
The conspiracy theories are really just silly. You honestly think there was some back room meeting between LUAL ALPA and the arbitrators coming up with some secret deal to appease the LUAL pilots? Come on... You can't really truly believe that.
05-25-2015, 06:24 PM
#203
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: A320 Cap
Posts: 2,282
Originally Posted by baseball
I listened to the UAL reps at various opportunities talk very big about de-certing ALPA should they not get what they demanded. I sat and had drinks with them and listened to them become angry and continue to beat their chests about seniority this and seniority that leading up to the merger and pre-merger announcement. I probably had heard reps from various bases rant on about 4 separate occasions and I have also looked at various forum postings and had emails sent to me directly and via blind CC stating their positions and that of their membership. I wouldn't call it "secret". I would call it out in he open, conspicuous and obvious. Now, what was said to the arbitrators behind closed doors and in other forms of communication I can't speak to. But, I know what they said to each other in person, and via email, and via forums.
05-25-2015, 06:32 PM
#204
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,083
Originally Posted by baseball
I listened to the UAL reps at various opportunities talk very big about de-certing ALPA should they not get what they demanded. I sat and had drinks with them and listened to them become angry and continue to beat their chests about seniority this and seniority that leading up to the merger and pre-merger announcement. I probably had heard reps from various bases rant on about 4 separate occasions and I have also looked at various forum postings and had emails sent to me directly and via blind CC stating their positions and that of their membership. I wouldn't call it "secret". I would call it out in he open, conspicuous and obvious. Now, what was said to the arbitrators behind closed doors and in other forms of communication I can't speak to. But, I know what they said to each other in person, and via email, and via forums.
05-25-2015, 06:40 PM
#205
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Position: Gets weekends off
Posts: 1,168
Originally Posted by Mitch Rapp05
600 of you went from working at Home Depot to line holders overnight, forcing employed pilots backwards...that is called a windfall.
We all understand the argument to ignore any longevity and just go 1-for-1 because CAL was a 4,700 pilot airline and UAL a 7,500 pilot airline. And your guys had the biggest set of cajones I've ever seen to present that as their choice and really try to push for it. Maybe since you're so level headed you needed to tell those guys "Hey maybe we shouldn't try to put our furloughed pilots ahead of their current Captains. They were profitable for the last 9 quarters and we've lost over $1B in that same time frame." You were probably too busy trying to figure out how long it would take you to move up to 747 Captain though.
You can cry conspiracy all you want, but those pilots were pilots at United long before October 1st, 2010 and they deserved to not have their seniority ignored.
Its done. None of us are happy with it, it must have been the right decision.
Last edited by pilot64golfer; 05-25-2015 at 06:53 PM.
05-25-2015, 06:48 PM
#206
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Posts: 112
Originally Posted by pilot64golfer
Those pilots were hired AFTER the ones they went senior to. It was the policy to do that.
That's how seniority works. People hired after you are junior to you.
That's how seniority works. People hired after you are junior to you.
05-25-2015, 06:54 PM
#207
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Posts: 112
Originally Posted by gettinbumped
The problem with your argument is that the SLI followed ALPA merger policy, which was changed to its present form before the merger was announced. The conspiracy theories are really just silly. You honestly think there was some back room meeting between LUAL ALPA and the arbitrators coming up with some secret deal to appease the LUAL pilots? Come on... You can't really truly believe that.
For the record, most LUAL pilots (particularly the 1998 pilots who weren't furloughed but lost 8 YESRS) think they were screwed in the SLI, just as most LCAL pilots do. That's the nature of the merger beast. It really would behoove you, and all of us, to just accept it and move on.
For the record, most LUAL pilots (particularly the 1998 pilots who weren't furloughed but lost 8 YESRS) think they were screwed in the SLI, just as most LCAL pilots do. That's the nature of the merger beast. It really would behoove you, and all of us, to just accept it and move on.
05-25-2015, 06:56 PM
#208
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Posts: 112
Originally Posted by pilot64golfer
So you're talking about the UAL 1997 hires and beyond that were paired with pilots with less than half as much per-merger seniority, right?
05-25-2015, 06:59 PM
#209
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Posts: 112
Originally Posted by sleeves
There were 37 Capt positions on 14-02a. There were 271 f/o vacancies that were filled by mostly returning LUAL furloughed pilots and new hires. It is untrue that this bid stole Capt. Upgrade vacancies for years to come. It is all listed on Flying together. I have moved on, as you noted I had forgotten about the bid as it was insignificant.
05-25-2015, 06:59 PM
#210
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Position: Gets weekends off
Posts: 1,168
Originally Posted by Kilder
You mean the 1998 hires that sat as junior UAL FO's at the merger and now magically they are Jumbo FO's or senior NB FO's or better at the base of their choosing...them fellas.
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