2025 Class Drops
12-01-2025 | 11:05 AM
#1021
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 4,065
Likes: 246
It's heavier so will burn more regardless, the airframe is not composite so is life limited and will have significant costs associated with it in 20-30 years, and it will be an orphan fleet.
There's probably a reason the 787 outsells the 330neo 5:1 that us armchair CEOs aren't aware of.
12-01-2025 | 03:15 PM
#1023
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 1,540
Likes: 127
Weird cause the 787 has almost as many orders this year as the 330neo has its entire existence.
It's heavier so will burn more regardless, the airframe is not composite so is life limited and will have significant costs associated with it in 20-30 years, and it will be an orphan fleet.
There's probably a reason the 787 outsells the 330neo 5:1 that us armchair CEOs aren't aware of.
It's heavier so will burn more regardless, the airframe is not composite so is life limited and will have significant costs associated with it in 20-30 years, and it will be an orphan fleet.
There's probably a reason the 787 outsells the 330neo 5:1 that us armchair CEOs aren't aware of.
12-01-2025 | 06:10 PM
#1024
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 4,065
Likes: 246
12-01-2025 | 07:27 PM
#1025
Line Holder
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 1,599
Likes: 153
From: B747 FO
I’m no PhD but I look at things this way. DL/UA keep flying all those rusty old unprofitable “small” fleets, 75/76/77/330……and even though we supposedly have a “solid” argument to justify getting rid of them, the only truth that matters is they are making WAY more money than we are.
Their strategies are paying off, and ours isn’t.
Thinking about 20-30 years from now is great, but we better put our sh*t together and start getting close to their numbers NOW, not 2 decades from now.
12-02-2025 | 07:19 AM
#1027
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,028
Likes: 246
From: A320 FO
Yet they make it work and make way more than we make without them.
I’m no PhD but I look at things this way. DL/UA keep flying all those rusty old unprofitable “small” fleets, 75/76/77/330……and even though we supposedly have a “solid” argument to justify getting rid of them, the only truth that matters is they are making WAY more money than we are.
Their strategies are paying off, and ours isn’t.
Thinking about 20-30 years from now is great, but we better put our sh*t together and start getting close to their numbers NOW, not 2 decades from now.
I’m no PhD but I look at things this way. DL/UA keep flying all those rusty old unprofitable “small” fleets, 75/76/77/330……and even though we supposedly have a “solid” argument to justify getting rid of them, the only truth that matters is they are making WAY more money than we are.
Their strategies are paying off, and ours isn’t.
Thinking about 20-30 years from now is great, but we better put our sh*t together and start getting close to their numbers NOW, not 2 decades from now.
Everything management says seems to make logical sense: simplified fleet, pay down the debt, expand premium, more credit card revenue. As you say, the proof of the pudding is in the eating.
The competition is crushing us and paying cash for the new jets that will replace the old, rusty ones. The theory that they would have to finance a fleet refresh at vastly higher interest rates is being proved wrong by their massive free cash flows.
12-02-2025 | 08:19 AM
#1028
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 4,065
Likes: 246
Really has little to do with our fleet though.
Even prior to covid we were basically break even in the TATL market and Asia lost money every year except for that big $7b year we had in...2016? when fuel prices fell.
We generally make our money domestically and in LATAM theatres. Domestic has been weak the past few years when the Covid travel boom happened since that was heavy TATL, and we had that Vasu induced business travel flop that accentuated it.
Just a bad combo of punches. Although like you, I am tired of the excuses. They had a really good plan pre-Covid and we sort of lost our mojo.
Even prior to covid we were basically break even in the TATL market and Asia lost money every year except for that big $7b year we had in...2016? when fuel prices fell.
We generally make our money domestically and in LATAM theatres. Domestic has been weak the past few years when the Covid travel boom happened since that was heavy TATL, and we had that Vasu induced business travel flop that accentuated it.
Just a bad combo of punches. Although like you, I am tired of the excuses. They had a really good plan pre-Covid and we sort of lost our mojo.
12-02-2025 | 07:42 PM
#1029
On Reserve
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 181
Likes: 1
We have no identity. We have no direction. United is starting caviar service. Their premium product craps all over ours. Our service is a joke. Hell even their snack selection is wayyy better
are we trying to out compete spirit? Or UAL & DAL? Why is our mx Mel’ing first class seats due to missing life jackets when they could’ve put new ones in on the 3 times we touched a mx base in one day instead of downgrading our best paying premium passengers?
or grab one from 36 E instead and plop it in 3c? This place will trip over a 20$ bill to grab a penny.
are we trying to out compete spirit? Or UAL & DAL? Why is our mx Mel’ing first class seats due to missing life jackets when they could’ve put new ones in on the 3 times we touched a mx base in one day instead of downgrading our best paying premium passengers?
or grab one from 36 E instead and plop it in 3c? This place will trip over a 20$ bill to grab a penny.
12-03-2025 | 09:30 AM
#1030
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Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 586
Likes: 67
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