Us/aa sli
04-20-2012 | 04:45 PM
#21
Flies With The Hat On
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,339
Likes: 0
From: Right of the Left Seat
Subject: Notes from APA Meeting
Name stays AA
HQ in DFW
US comes to Oneworld (hurts UAL)
Pay banding
Starting point is current green book.
5.5% raise on date of signing
3% / yrs 2-6, then avg of UAL/DAL
A319 no longer a sep payband
Vac goes to 3+40/day. Better accrual
Hard freeze & 14% DC Plan
PBS. US West pilots love it. Well managed. Lines 83. P/u to 90. Keep current rigs.
Scope committee is "giddy" with what is offered. Parker doesn't understand code share. He wants the revenue. Max Dom code share = 4% of total asm's.
Keeping AA's Boeing/Bus order. Very excited to get 787.
Unsure about AE. Parker wants to see books then decide. Hates 50 seaters. Prob convert most 319 orders to 320/321's.
Med costs will go from 14% to 17% (I think 1113 had it going to 26%.
Not a sure thing, but APA seems quite confident. No timeline given, more than 2 mos, possibly by end of summer. Horton is said to be steaming mad.
Seniority may go to expedited arbitration. Expect percentile in type over any DOH (aka DAL/NWA)
US East guys will get about 25-30% raise out of this.
Name stays AA
HQ in DFW
US comes to Oneworld (hurts UAL)
Pay banding
Starting point is current green book.
5.5% raise on date of signing
3% / yrs 2-6, then avg of UAL/DAL
A319 no longer a sep payband
Vac goes to 3+40/day. Better accrual
Hard freeze & 14% DC Plan
PBS. US West pilots love it. Well managed. Lines 83. P/u to 90. Keep current rigs.
Scope committee is "giddy" with what is offered. Parker doesn't understand code share. He wants the revenue. Max Dom code share = 4% of total asm's.
Keeping AA's Boeing/Bus order. Very excited to get 787.
Unsure about AE. Parker wants to see books then decide. Hates 50 seaters. Prob convert most 319 orders to 320/321's.
Med costs will go from 14% to 17% (I think 1113 had it going to 26%.
Not a sure thing, but APA seems quite confident. No timeline given, more than 2 mos, possibly by end of summer. Horton is said to be steaming mad.
Seniority may go to expedited arbitration. Expect percentile in type over any DOH (aka DAL/NWA)
US East guys will get about 25-30% raise out of this.
Thank you Bill Lumberg,
This is one of the most relevant APF posts I've ever seen. Do you have more specifics on scope? Is scope proposed to stay in the ~76 seat range? How many more 70+ seat regionals will AA want to operate?
I hope all three of our groups work together. Nic or not, there is plenty of opportunity for East & West in this transaction with APA. I would think the courts will settle all East/West SLI lawsuits soon. We need to keep in mind how well NW and DL pilot groups worked together.
04-20-2012 | 08:54 PM
#23
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,707
Likes: 0
No comparison between AA/TWA and AA/US whatsoever. Two totally different scenarios, dynamics, sizes, career expectations, etc. In fact, the ONLY similarity is that AA is in Ch 11, but in a vastly different financial picture than TWA was at the time of acquisition. USAir won't be "picking up the assets of AMR" like AMR did with TWA. This deal will be a full blown merger, much like DL/NW and UA/CO.
Not saying the staple job was fair: it wasn't. And also not saying I won't get screwed: I fully expect to lose a ton of seniority out of this if it goes through. More than anything, I hope we DID learn a ton from our past mistakes.
And there is not a day that goes by where I don't say a prayer of thanks for my job!
Regards,
73
Not saying the staple job was fair: it wasn't. And also not saying I won't get screwed: I fully expect to lose a ton of seniority out of this if it goes through. More than anything, I hope we DID learn a ton from our past mistakes.
And there is not a day that goes by where I don't say a prayer of thanks for my job!
Regards,
73
04-20-2012 | 09:28 PM
#24
AAmerican Way for AA Pay
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,617
Likes: 0
From: B-737 Pilot
No comparison between AA/TWA and AA/US whatsoever. Two totally different scenarios, dynamics, sizes, career expectations, etc. In fact, the ONLY similarity is that AA is in Ch 11, but in a vastly different financial picture than TWA was at the time of acquisition. USAir won't be "picking up the assets of AMR" like AMR did with TWA. This deal will be a full blown merger, much like DL/NW and UA/CO.
If so, my question to YOU is merely this:
"What are YOUR career expectations since you work for a BANKRUPT airline?"
See how it feels? Don't expect US pilots to have any sympathy for you or AA's financial position, either, if all this comes to pass.
04-20-2012 | 11:05 PM
#25
Banned
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,007
Likes: 0
From: Space Shuttle PIC
It's up to the creditors and the judge mainly. Boeing and Airbus are happy that the orders for 73's and 319s are still intact. And notice they keep the politicians happy by keeping HQ in DFW, saving up to 6000 jobs compared to the AMR plan, and keep the AA name.
04-21-2012 | 04:08 AM
#26
Line Holder
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,328
Likes: 57
Best Guess, if AMR currently has 7000 active pilots (not sure actual number) they will ratio in 7000. The rest would have recall rights. This could result in active AMR pilots being stapled with those on furlough bypass being ratio'd in above them in the final list.
04-21-2012 | 04:37 AM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,075
Likes: 0
2 Gal Ogre's Blood
1 Tbsp Eye of Newt
1 Tbsp Lizards Gizzard
2 Tsp Wing of Bat
Mix ingredients in large iron pot over open fire...
Good Lord. This is going to be noisy. We are going to have to get another internet. This one won't be big enough for all the "discourse" (and I use that term loosely) we are going to see both here and on the other message boards.
1 Tbsp Eye of Newt
1 Tbsp Lizards Gizzard
2 Tsp Wing of Bat
Mix ingredients in large iron pot over open fire...
Good Lord. This is going to be noisy. We are going to have to get another internet. This one won't be big enough for all the "discourse" (and I use that term loosely) we are going to see both here and on the other message boards.
04-21-2012 | 04:42 AM
#28
Line Holder
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 96
Likes: 0
From: Captain, SS Orca
I think that the 1600 number includes those that have bypassed, which is a pretty big number. The Bypassers would be treated as if they were on property at their current seniority. Those that haven't been offered recall, probably staple.
04-21-2012 | 04:46 AM
#29
Line Holder
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 96
Likes: 0
From: Captain, SS Orca
I think he's more referring to "full blown merger" as in the whole airlines merge. Rather than one picking and choosing the others assets that they want. i.e. a fragmentation scenario.
04-21-2012 | 05:19 AM
#30
I have shiny jet syndrome
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 984
Likes: 0
From: ELACS, FACs and SECs. Who doesn't love 'em?
2 Gal Ogre's Blood
1 Tbsp Eye of Newt
1 Tbsp Lizards Gizzard
2 Tsp Wing of Bat
Mix ingredients in large iron pot over open fire...
Good Lord. This is going to be noisy. We are going to have to get another internet. This one won't be big enough for all the "discourse" (and I use that term loosely) we are going to see both here and on the other message boards.
1 Tbsp Eye of Newt
1 Tbsp Lizards Gizzard
2 Tsp Wing of Bat
Mix ingredients in large iron pot over open fire...
Good Lord. This is going to be noisy. We are going to have to get another internet. This one won't be big enough for all the "discourse" (and I use that term loosely) we are going to see both here and on the other message boards.
(Ending that previous sentence with a preposition was unintentional and purely coincidental. It's nothing to be alarmed by.)
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
