Us/aa sli
04-21-2012 | 04:15 PM
#51
Banned
Joined: Jun 2008
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I assume most of you guys know this, but the SLI legislation, known as the McCaskill-Bond statute, was signed into law in December 2007 and is codified at 49 U.S.C. § 42112.
If this does happen it will be seen as a merger and will most likely be slotted by equipment. Not to sound condescending, but it was just killing me to read some of these posts.
If this does happen it will be seen as a merger and will most likely be slotted by equipment. Not to sound condescending, but it was just killing me to read some of these posts.
Do the UAL/CAL, DAL/NWA, U/AWA or SWA/Air Tran SLI's for example, all mimick each other or do they have variables based on the specifics of the individual situation ?
"Fair and equitable" is a loose and subjective concept. Ask 20 pilots and you'd get 20 different answers. Get an opinion from 5 different arbitrators and you'd get 5 results not identical. We're post M-B with all thse situations and none are identical.
Personally, on AA/U we're getting worked up a bit prematurely here on this issue, if you ask me.
04-21-2012 | 08:28 PM
#52
Banned
Joined: Apr 2008
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This is far from done but it is fun to speculate. The west would like to see a relative position integration with protection on the widebody's for the Aa guys long enough to give most Aa an oppurtunity to fly the birds they brought. The east pilots want DOH and your 777 manuals ASAP
04-21-2012 | 09:37 PM
#53
Flies With The Hat On
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,339
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From: Right of the Left Seat
You have got to be kidding me! You want this deal at Delta? Managment will sign it tomorrow. My goals are way more then a couple of percent more then our current rates and I think you should set your sights a lot higher also. 3 percent is not going to cut it. Not even close.
04-21-2012 | 11:08 PM
#54
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,458
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From: Right Seat
In my opinion, anyone furloughed, including those choosing not to accept recall, need to be stapled below all active pilots. Layoff is layoff. All active pilots need to be integrated on a relative seniority basis. If you chose not to accept recall, then that was a gamble that you took. if you were not on property at time of merger, then you should start out below all active pilots.
04-22-2012 | 12:13 AM
#55
Line Holder
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 28
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Fort Worth Chamber, Dallas Regional Chamber Issue Joint Statement on American Airlines Takeover Bid - Yahoo! Finance
FORT WORTH, Texas, April 20, 2012 /PRNewswire/ -- The Fort Worth Chamber and Dallas Regional Chamber – the two largest Chambers in the region – held full board meetings Thursday and Friday mornings, and the subject of American Airlines was discussed.*
Following those meetings, Fort Worth Chamber President and CEO Bill Thornton and Dallas Regional Chamber President and CEO Amb. James C. Oberwetter wish to speak as a single voice on the subject:
We are greatly concerned by the potential impact that American's union employees' support of U.S. Airways' intentions could have on both the bankruptcy proceedings and the local economy, and are opposed to any mergers prior to American exiting bankruptcy.* While it may seem to some that this is an option, it's actually a damaging distraction that will disrupt American's thoughtful process already in place to preserve the most jobs in Dallas/Fort Worth, and the state of Texas, both now and once American has exited bankruptcy.
American Airlines' brand equity stands alone. Aviation is a legacy industry in our region, and American's headquarters in Fort Worth and presence at DFW Airport brings international recognition to North Texas. The company has provided jobs for generations of residents who live in communities all across the region.* In addition, American Airlines has benefited dozens of communities with charitable contributions.* A merger risks losing all that, and more.
The best outlook for all American employees is for the airline to remain independent and headquartered in North Texas. We urge the creditors and unions working with American to not be distracted by the efforts of other carriers to disrupt the proceedings.* Allow the bankruptcy process to run its course.* American's management has the exclusive right to submit a plan of reorganization until late September.* Completing this essential step is in the best interests of American's employees, creditors, Fort Worth, Dallas and all the communities served by American Airlines.*
04-22-2012 | 12:15 AM
#56
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,357
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It depends by what you mean by "out of seniority."
IMO, they are not flying CA out of seniority. Here's why: TWA CA jobs are protected under the terms of Supplement CC, which guarantees a certain number of CA jobs in STL based on a ratio of DFW and ORD CA jobs. If DFW/ORD CA jobs go up, so do STL CA jobs. If they shrink, so does STL.
So, in essence, TWA pilots have their own seniority list in STL. A pilot hired at TWA in 1988 carries around a 7500 AA seniority number, and has the seniority to fly as CA but only based out of STL, the protected cell. Otherwise, a 7500 seniority at AA is approx. 2000 numbers away from holding an AA CA position anywhere else in the system.
That's why you'll hear some natives whining about them flying out of seniority. They aren't. They are simply upgrading based on their protected seniority list.
Approximately 1100 TWA pilots got slotted in at 1:8 (1 TWA pilot per 8 AA pilots) and approx. 1300 TWA pilots got stapled representing about 46% integrated, 54% stapled. The TWA Date of Hire cutoff between integrated vs stapled is 1989.
IMO, they are not flying CA out of seniority. Here's why: TWA CA jobs are protected under the terms of Supplement CC, which guarantees a certain number of CA jobs in STL based on a ratio of DFW and ORD CA jobs. If DFW/ORD CA jobs go up, so do STL CA jobs. If they shrink, so does STL.
So, in essence, TWA pilots have their own seniority list in STL. A pilot hired at TWA in 1988 carries around a 7500 AA seniority number, and has the seniority to fly as CA but only based out of STL, the protected cell. Otherwise, a 7500 seniority at AA is approx. 2000 numbers away from holding an AA CA position anywhere else in the system.
That's why you'll hear some natives whining about them flying out of seniority. They aren't. They are simply upgrading based on their protected seniority list.
Approximately 1100 TWA pilots got slotted in at 1:8 (1 TWA pilot per 8 AA pilots) and approx. 1300 TWA pilots got stapled representing about 46% integrated, 54% stapled. The TWA Date of Hire cutoff between integrated vs stapled is 1989.
04-22-2012 | 02:18 AM
#57
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,190
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From: 767ER capt
This is far from done but it is fun to speculate. The west would like to see a relative position integration with protection on the widebody's for the Aa guys long enough to give most Aa an oppurtunity to fly the birds they brought. The east pilots want DOH and your 777 manuals ASAP
04-22-2012 | 02:47 AM
#58
Line Holder
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 96
Likes: 0
From: Captain, SS Orca
In my opinion, anyone furloughed, including those choosing not to accept recall, need to be stapled below all active pilots. Layoff is layoff. All active pilots need to be integrated on a relative seniority basis. If you chose not to accept recall, then that was a gamble that you took. if you were not on property at time of merger, then you should start out below all active pilots.
04-22-2012 | 04:01 AM
#59
On Reserve
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
So let's take a guy at Ual ( 747 captain) that took the voluntary furlough and staple him because his airline merged while he was out. Makes no sense.
04-22-2012 | 04:47 AM
#60
On Reserve
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 11
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Good luck nobody's going to buy it. AA is no where close to the carrier it was. It not to late for Usair to shore up the funding to make an out right buy out for AA. TWA pilots supported Usair East. They hated to hear that " we bought you" argument to screw pilots out of seniority they even got a bill passed to protect this from happening again. Come to terms with the irony in this. AA is not much different then where TWA was look at what it been like for career exp compared to the guys at Cal and Swa. APA referred to the TWA pilots as kmart and AA was Saks . A disgrace to every airline pilot. I think USair will hammer APA on this.
need to hammer APA on this. Good luck to you both !
need to hammer APA on this. Good luck to you both !
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