Herkflyr

You are basing your arguments against VBs using "potential crash pad quality?" There are arguments against VBs but that surely isn't one.

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waldo135

[QUOTE=Hank Kingsley;2568104]And a job killer. Yet, when it’s any other ‘job killer’ there’s wailing and knashing of teeth. The message we send to the company... if you’ll just let me make as much as I want, I’ll give you productivity.

Han Solo

No, quite the opposite. I am specifically refuting a point somebody made earlier that they could save $$ by getting rid of their crash pad because of a VB. As if saving crash pad money were a point in favor of VBs.

Buck Rogers

Because:

1. What we have now is a long standing status quo
2. The airline is currently staffed at this historical current status quo
level
3. To change the "system" will be a productivity loss for the
company
4. The company doesn't just "give" away inefficiencies...they charge
us for them.
5. That creates winners and losers.
6. This is a zero sum game. To "fix" your perceived inadequacies in
the system some will win and some will lose.

What you a suggesting smacks of socialism. Your utopia is a more "equal" playing field. So, why stop there? Lets pay band all equipment and only have Capt pay and FO pay. Oh wait, why stop there ...let's just have pilot pay, ALL pilots paid the same. Personally, i don't like the longevity steps, let's abolish those too. So, 1 pay scale all pilots all equipment and while were are at it lower the alv to 60, think how may people would move up and get a relative seniority boost with all the new jobs created. And while were are protecting us from ourselves, let's change the bottle to throttle rule to 12 hours...no wait, let's really protect us...absolutely NO drinking on layovers. Oh, and how bout that vacation that is pay no credit....let's make it pay AND credit so nobody can "fly back" their vacation time

Pretty slippery slope don't you think? Why do you pose the question as if anybody that doesn't agree with you must be a fool?

So, I am sitting at home with 8 days off between trips and I have plans to paint my house. Estimated days to completion- 5 days. A three day trip comes up in open time and I am legal for it FAR wise and contractually. I pick it up- 1 leg out layover 1 leg back. but I iron man it back. gone 2 days---pay? 22 hours at nominally $300/hr with the plus up for DC makes it approx. $350/hr Total= $7700 for 2 days

So I pay someone to paint my house while I take a golfing retreat with the left over money and 6 days time off. Is that a QOL improvement? I think yes, you are welcome to disagree. Did it affect you. I think not because that is how categories are currently staffed, so nobody "stole" your cheese- you are welcome to feel slighted

So there is my answer on why I am not concerned with it. Why do you want to steal my cheese? Let the system play out like it has the past 10 years. Changes have been made to level the field ie. abolishing trip parking, no longer pre-sell vacation, and the biggest one is the drastic reduction of trip credit time which is the biggest limiter on excessive pick up. In addition, the FAR limitations also act as a limiter

OBTW. not only does the current system allow some to pick up time which enhances their QOL but the guy that is allowed to give up the trip gets a QOL of life improvement too.

Han Solo

Yeah, let free market reign without checks and balances. In fact to avoid such nasty smacking of socialism let's just allow every pilot negotiate their own rate in a race to the bottom. Worked great bringing us regional airlines, think how awesome it will be when the rich CEOs get a free hand to manipulate EVERY pilot against every other pilot. Just disband the union now and every man for himself!

Gooner

It’s easy to carry an argument to the extreme to make it sound irrational.

Why are we afraid to pay for something that pays us all?

What if you got paid 1.5 or 2x for that 2 day trip. Now you can paint your neighbors house too and go on a golf outing.

Change doesn’t have to be bad.

LCAhotline

This this this. I drop trips like a mofo. We have green slips in place that a pilot can make 200%. The system we have now works just fine for me. I just dropped a two day so that I can go to my kids baseball tryouts. Cost to me is $1200 to attend a freaking baseball tryout. Someone else white slipped it, but that baseball tryout is very important for me and more importantly my little bambino.

You think the company is gonna let me drop that if they have to turn around and pay someone else $2400+ to do the same amount of work? No.

There is more to life than money. I am more concerned with getting min day, 5:15 for training. 5:15 for vacation. Eliminate virtual basing. Those are improvements. As sweet as it’d be to do a DH to Grand Rapids on day 1, layover and do a leg back on day 2 for $2400 that ain’t gonna happen.

Hank Kingsley

OTOH, I'm watching 777A's swap 3 day for 6 days, flying to the limit, every month. Is that QOL? If money equals QOL, yes. I'm working the deal the other way around for time off. I don't want that messed with either.

Gunfighter

I'd like to say thank you to the pilot who WS my 3-day trip over capped reserve days. I was able to attend my grandson's birthday and my nephew's confirmation. Those three days were more important to me than money. For the WS pilot the money was more valuable than those three days. The system works fine as it is.

Those who argue the WS pickups reduce jobs are over inflating the issue. The staffing is based on summer schedules, where there is already little or no room to WS above ALV. The reality is that those who WS and PSP above ALV are providing flexibility for those who do not want to work as hard in the slower months. They have little impact in the summer months and therefore little impact on manning.

LCAhotline

Boom. Same point I made in the post above. So maybe we can get back to talking about killing virtual basing!