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Old 01-22-2020 | 10:57 AM
  #461  
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Originally Posted by Jaxs170
Our (NYC 73N) bid package is falling apart very rapidly. I'm top 10% and I can't get M-F commutable anymore. Once the NEOs show up it will get worse as they start taking over our best flying. The 737 is destined to become the next MD-90.
I feel for ya man, the optimizer ruined the A-320 fleet in NYC. I think the past year was the optimizer seeing how far they can actually hose a community (A320) before turning their eyes to the remaining fleets.
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Old 01-22-2020 | 11:15 AM
  #462  
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Originally Posted by crewdawg
Just flipped through some narrow body bid packets/wides...wow! Base on that and the noticeable lack of premium vacation weeks available, I expect to see WB FO go senior and NB A go junior. I know that for whatever reason, we'll always have those that just have to get back in the left seat ASAP. But we'll probably see a new type of junior NB A that simply say screw it, my schedule is already crappy, might as well make the pay.

Even as a fairly junior WB FO, there is no way you could get me to bid NB A right now. When even the top 1/3rd are getting coverage and barely able to get a premium vacation, it just isn't worth the little bump in pay I'd see. Our domestic rotation construction and work rules need a massive overhaul.
I feel like as my seniority has finally started to move up at a decent clip (ATL 73N B) my trips and overall schedule have at the same time gone downhill. I'm sure I'm not the only one. If I could hold it I'd definitely go over to NB A (in base) and sit res. Because like you said...screw it, if my schedule sucks either way, I'll take the extra pay.
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Old 01-22-2020 | 11:23 AM
  #463  
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Originally Posted by DELTAFO
Which newsletter says that 76 retirements are accelerating?
Jan2020:
”We just got word that the 767 T models will not be going through the Ultra High-Density mod as planned. This most likely means these aircraft will be headed to the bone yard when their heavy checks come due instead of flying until 2030 as previously planned.”
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Old 01-22-2020 | 11:38 AM
  #464  
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Originally Posted by FL370esq
Or the NB Capt categories where the top 1/3 can't hold decent vacation weeks....that just ain't right. Guess that was "their" solution to last summer's goat rope.
The “optimizing” feedback loop will eventually result in the contractually mandated minimum vacation award during summer months (or even a fail to award minimum al la international block hour “mistakes”) and half the company on vacation between February and March.
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Old 01-22-2020 | 12:19 PM
  #465  
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Originally Posted by crewdawg
Line holders in the top half can't be given coverage. However, reserves could get coverage even if they're the number 2 person in category to bid reserve. Not everyone in to top third bid a line. 30% in DTW320A got coverage on reserve.
If line holders can’t be given coverage trips, why are there two different colors on the wide report? The light blue rotations are the normally assigned trips, so what do you call the purple rotations?
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Old 01-22-2020 | 12:31 PM
  #466  
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Originally Posted by FL370esq
Or the NB Capt categories where the top 1/3 can't hold decent vacation weeks....that just ain't right. Guess that was "their" solution to last summer's goat rope.
Poor wording on my part. My 1/3rd comment was in reference to coverage. Decrease in premium vacation weeks was more a general comment since it seems to have been a trend this year.

Originally Posted by TED74
I fly with former (relatively senior) WB Bs who say their pay as NB A is a significant jump over their previous earnings. What do you figure your theoretical difference to be such that you call it only a "little bump"?
I'm ~90% in my current category and would be that or worse on any NB A in my base (I won't commute). To jump to NB A, I figured somewhere between 2-4k/month increase BEFORE taxes. When you look at it through the lens of pay per day worked it isn't a huge increase. In many instances, day-for-day, I'm very close or even slightly ahead of those in the 320A. On top of that, save a few holidays, I have nearly complete control over my schedule in my current category. I basically drop everything and pick up the more efficient trips that easily allow me to close the gap on pay/day worked. This is before I even consider the fact that sitting reserve in base for me drives that number up big time, not to mention QOL on reserve is MUCH better on a WB. Based on the NB A wides/coverage, I'd have nearly zero control over my schedule, which be a huge hit in QOL.

Oddly enough, as I work my way up to 12 year pay, the pay gap gets less and less.

Originally Posted by DWC CAP10 USAF
If line holders can’t be given coverage trips, why are there two different colors on the wide report? The light blue rotations are the normally assigned trips, so what do you call the purple rotations?
Coverage for line holders can only go up to 70% (of line holders) in non-holiday months and 50% in holiday months. On reserve, coverage is dictated my 12.M.4, which in some categories means each X-day needs to be available once. This means the number 2 guy bidding reserve could easily be subject to coverage.

Last edited by crewdawg; 01-22-2020 at 12:43 PM.
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Old 01-22-2020 | 12:39 PM
  #467  
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Originally Posted by crewdawg
Poor wording on my part. My 1/3rd comment was in reference to coverage. Decrease in premium vacation weeks was more a general comment since it seems to have been a trend this year.



I'm ~90% in my current category and would be that or worse on any NB A in my base (I won't commute). To jump to NB A, I figured somewhere between 2-4k/month increase BEFORE taxes. When you look at it through the lens of pay per day worked it isn't a huge increase. In many instances, day-for-day, I'm very close or even slightly ahead of those in the 320A. On top of that, save a few holidays, I have nearly complete control over my schedule in my current category. I basically drop everything and pick up the more efficient trips that easily allow me to close the gap on pay/day worked. This is before I even consider the fact that sitting reserve in base for me drives that number up big time, not to mention QOL on reserve is MUCH better on a WB. Based on the NB A wides/coverage, I'd have nearly zero control over my schedule, which be a huge hit in QOL.

Oddly enough, as I work my way up to 12 year pay, the pay gap gets less and less.



Coverage for line holders can only go up to 75% (of line holders) in non-holiday months and 50% in holiday months. On reserve, coverage is dictated my 12.M.4, which in some categories means each X-day needs to be available once. This means the number 2 guy bidding reserve could easily be subject to coverage.
I was unaware of the 50%/75% thresholds...what’s the PWA references for my future reference?

Please and Thank You.
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Old 01-22-2020 | 12:45 PM
  #468  
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Originally Posted by DWC CAP10 USAF
I was unaware of the 50%/75% thresholds...what’s the PWA references for my future reference?

Please and Thank You.
I told you wrong (edited), it's 70% in non-holiday months and not 75%. PWA MOU #1.C.2.b.1&2.
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Old 01-22-2020 | 02:49 PM
  #469  
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Originally Posted by BlueSkies
I feel like as my seniority has finally started to move up at a decent clip (ATL 73N B) my trips and overall schedule have at the same time gone downhill. I'm sure I'm not the only one.
Oh, it’s definitely not just you. My 88 trips at 20% seniority were far worse than at 50% just a couple of years ago.

Schedule and reroute protections are my top issues for this contract. People may flame me over it but 🤷🏼‍♂️. I’ve got too long left doing this job to fly these horrible schedules.
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Old 01-22-2020 | 03:54 PM
  #470  
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Help clear something up for me:

The ALPA interactive dashboard shows projected ATL 73N B at 332 FO's.

The AE document published for this bid has a Forecast of Pilot Staffing table on page 6 of the PDF. This shows ATL 73N B at 392 FO's.

Does this mean that ATL 73N B is growing by 67 FO's between now and August? Or am I missing something?
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