Newish Delta guy here. Do you mind to DM me the Facebook group info? I’m already in the scheduling help group and that’s super helpful. Would like to see what else is out there for discussions like these. Thanks!


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Since you like baseball analogies... I'll take 3 walks and the #4 hitter getting 4 RBIs over singles and an occasional double. Those chances for fly outs and double play balls are more likely to end the inning early with hits, but no runs.

 

This section alone could take another 6 months. I hope they don’t concede anything here. This and scope are the only two things I’ll be voting on.

 

It's not baseball. This would work only if you weren't negotiating with people being paid millions of dollars to pay as little as possible on one specific deal. If you continually accept the first middling offer, it is in the interest of the other party to keep offering less and less to play into the strategy of you accepting a fast deal over a good one. Management is paid to "increase shareholder value" which here means find a way to spend less money on labor. It is in their interest to offer the least possible, including $0.0 by just dragging things out asking for concessions, or offering inflation_rate - n%.

Any strategy that doesn't understand this fundamentally misses how labor loses value over time. Management has no time pressure to make a deal unless you make pressure. They aren't selling anything, they are agreeing to pay for what they are already getting and I guess will keep getting at no extra cost. They don't lose money UNTIL they make a deal, unless something changes.

 

That's just it... they really didn't send anything out.

 

Thats not completely honest. Did they provide specific numbers? No, of course not. But the overall tone is very different from previous updates and that says a lot.

 

Herkflyr, I understand your point. To be even more transparent, a pay raise of 24% would NOT equal the 3 sequential raises the FA's already received, agreed?
All the fancy accounting terms aside, It would take us getting a 25.5% raise just to match what they have been given to date. I am expecting more than that. . .(not trying in ANY way to lower expectations, just making sure we clearly understand what raises our fellow employees have been given by the company)

 

Once again, it's important to not post mistruths. The IFS Q&A doesn't say an FA flying an average line equals to a 16% increase. It gives multiple examples of different flying scheduled and 1 of those examples equals 16% (the highest) and some examples show it being 4-5%. The only way you're getting that 16% scenario is if you're flying a DREAFUL schedule. We've had boarding pay for 6 months now and I have yet to see any FA be over 10%, which is actually lower since boarding pay doesn't apply to sick time, vacation, credit time, deadheads etc so the overall raise is even smaller. In each one of my previous 6 months which are made up of a mix of international and domestic 50/50 i'm just under 7%.

You also CHOOSE to IGNORE the fact that we are also working more time now with boarding pay. Each leg we work an additional 5 minutes. Which further lowers the "real" raise that boarding pay brings.

Also, the 4% received in 2019 is the same raised pilots ALSO received in 2019. Just because we received it a couple of months after doesn't mean it's an "additional" raise, it's just the timing of the raises and i've shown this when I posted historical dates of FA raises which change quite often.

Here's a screenshot of the Q&A you're referring to:

 

This seems like a ridiculous point to make. Not going to get into a pilot vs. FA argument but instead of sitting and playing with your phone for 5 minutes out in the terminal you now sit and play with your phone for 5 minutes in the plane and get paid for it. I find it hard to believe that in reality there is any "extra" work being done for this pay.

 

We have to be onboard 5 extra minutes and have passengers onboard for 5 extra minutes. That’s extra work. That’s less personal time I have and more time I have to spend with passengers.

As far as your “phone” comments…blah…just shows a holier than thou attitude and entitlement some people have and isn’t really worth addressing.