I was speaking as an investor. As a pilot, I think it sucks, and you are probably right that it is a bit easier from the left seat however, I have not become any more senior as a result of that discipline.... And yes, I can differentiate between the two.

Not to mention we have no eventually essential next gen planes on order, while little AeroMexico has the latest and greatest. We've pushed ours out til 2020 (at least) for the 787, with no MAX or NEO's to speak of while a third world code share partner inks 11billion worth after we invest in them. At least we are getting 15-20 year old used planes.

There is some protection in the CS and JV language, but when it comes down to it, DL management appears to be more than willing to give up the flight revenue in order to let a phantom third party oputsource provider like AM or AS do it as long as the over all network is preserved or expanded. They will take the hit on the flight segment revenue as long as the network route map continues to win and the HVC's have lounges, especially if they don't have to spend money, grow operationally or add debt for anything. The end result is entirely unsustainnable as it puts us on an ever increasing cost structure trajectory requiring more and more capacity dicipline, which further increases our costs. Merging just to shrink is also a very limited solution and only adds to the funding of the ULCC and foreign ponzi scheme order books. By growing our outsource proxies, it lowers their unit costs relative to ours, which further incentivises them to keep growing them and shrinking us.

But it buffs the next quarter's numbers. Right up until it doesn't. Then golden parachues will be popped and it'll be someone else's problem.

Dropped 131 just at Comair, so yes.

So I'm jumpseating home and the Capt said he just had a 4th Flr on his jumpseat a couple days ago and the decision this week is 717s in Atl and NY to take over all the LaGuardia slots. I know not very juicy news but now the discussion on how junior the 717A side will be can begin.

We shall see. Best guess in 8500.

I thought this was the decision all along. That weekly newsletter said otherwise, but DAL has never had a typo before in their correspondence.:rolleyes: I just hope (not a strategy) that they are mostly growth airplanes. That is the real questionmark.

Heard as of yesterday 176 on the RMA. Figure 10-20% backout for a total of ~150. I guess this kills once and for all the early retirement and all it needed was a medical plan myth.

I guess a bunch of junior pilots are going to get a displacement pay cut instead of a raise, and no new hires for a while.

The further capacity reductions sort of kills the hope of the 2013 flying plan making up for the productivity increases and RMA shortfall.

I bet 717A and 88A all go more, not less senior than before the TA

I heard this also. I have said this before. There is no excuse for not retiring. Most pilots will not retire until they are forced to. This job is their identity. They cannot imagine not being an airline captain. We have former NWA whale captains literally working for $1500/month vs what they would be making if they retired. These guys would be making more money if they retired and took a job at year one pay flying a regional jet. That memo about us hiring as early as fourth quarter this year was a TA sell job by the company. I don't see us hiring until 2015 and that's only if we reverse course and stop shrinking. On a brighter note, we are shrinking at about the same pace pilots are leaving resulting in continued employment for everyone on property.

Continual backwards movement is a real moral buster. I am starting to see the 717 as simply another possible step in the wrong direction. If they aren't growth, which I am beginning to suspect they won't be, then their value to the pilot group will be a cushion to furlough. The early retirement, as many have posted, will benefit a select few. As far as the group as a whole, it won't be a blip.

MD90s, 737s, and 717s are all smaller/lower paying replacements to aircraft already on property. I would say a majority of the pilot group is about to take a pay cut, thus negating most of our supposed TA gains.

In the end, my glass is half empty regarding these future two AEs. I also don't have much confidence in any hiring rumors. Growth at Delta is going to be through merger and acquisition. Our answer to pilot attrition won't be through hiring, it will be through mergers and the capacity reductions that follow.