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-   -   Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta? (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delta/36912-any-latest-greatest-about-delta.html)

Timbo 01-01-2014 10:00 PM


Originally Posted by GogglesPisano (Post 1550872)
5 hours and no one has jumped on this yet? Seriously?

I heard Dixie Normus was all over it...:eek::D

NERD 01-02-2014 04:21 AM

So.... How has reserve been so far under the new rules? Are you reserve guys abiding by the contract or by SDs directive?

n9810f 01-02-2014 04:33 AM


Originally Posted by johnso29 (Post 1550688)
The same way Delta has squeezed more seats into the MD90. Remove a galley. That's my guess.

Thanks for the update. Would've preferred more staying.

The galley at door 2 comes out and first class is cut down to 20 with the forward coat storage bin at 1L or 1R on NWA planes coming out as well.

Herkflyr 01-02-2014 06:16 AM


Originally Posted by Flamer (Post 1550770)
No problem. Just whip up a quick memo from flight ops. Problem solved.

Uh, no.

The contract is very explicit. Beyond next-day open time will be covered automatically via PCS. Reserves are not even considered except for same or next-day open time.

Yes 117 is causing the company headaches, and yes it is beyond absurd that SD is trying to circumvent the contract via memo. But all that is related to reserve assignment rules, none of which are ever considered until the day prior at the earliest. There is no way the company could award a trip to a reserve two or three days out just to make scheduling's job easier.

gloopy 01-02-2014 07:57 AM


Originally Posted by Sink r8 (Post 1550840)
Very good synopsis.

We cannot wait until 3 hours prior to show to acknowledge, and fly the trip under Part 117.

So, I can clearly not drink from the cup in front of me.

OTOH, we (probably) don't have an obligation to acknowledge an assignment within 2 hours of contact.

So, I can clearly not drink from the cup in front of you.

Moral of the story: don't get involved in land wars in Southeast Asia, and don't get into a battle of wits with SD.

Except the fantasy memo in question is completely irrelevant. There is no 2 hour leash. Never was. The full spirit and intent of the 3 hours prior wasn't the 3 hours part, it was always and very clearly the 9 hour "blackout" period to rest uninterrupted so we're not on what would otherwise be a 24 hour acknowledgement quasi short call. I think SD is very, very smart. But for him to whip out the 2 hour fantasy leash isn't a very good example of wit or intelligence. Its pretty transparent that he was ordered to preserve 12 hour long call concept by any means necessary so he tried to rewrite the contract unilaterally within the contraints of the mandate he was given so as to preserve existing staffing flexibility that 12 hour leashes provide, despite the fact that is now an obselete concept. This was clearly a case of "just following orders" but its still irrelevant because the company can't rewrite the contract all by itself.

If the two glasses are undrinkable, then we need another glass. This is easilly solveable by the company, they are just choosing not to constructively engage the pilot group to do it and are instead relying on unilateral fiat that borders on flat out bullying. We have to see this through though. Not only to prevent the massive concession of a 2 hour fantasy leash, which would be a QOL destroyer especially for commuters, but to avoid setting the precedent that the company can just write themselves whatever contract they want with the self granted authority of a bankruptcy judge anytime they feel there is a need. That is simply not the case.

I'm sure DALPA would pencil whip a 19 hour long call with a 9 hour leash right now, and probably a couple hours shorter with some other minor issues being addressed. But 12 is simply unworkable and a 2 hour fantasy leash isn't some great intellectual case to drink from the glass of reasonableness. Its someone slapping their nightstick in their hand while saying "dance monkey, dance".

newKnow 01-02-2014 07:59 AM


Originally Posted by NERD (Post 1550933)
So.... How has reserve been so far under the new rules? Are you reserve guys abiding by the contract or by SDs directive?

Happy New Year, bro! :)

boog123 01-02-2014 08:50 AM


Originally Posted by gloopy (Post 1551012)
Except the fantasy memo in question is completely irrelevant. There is no 2 hour leash. Never was. The full spirit and intent of the 3 hours prior wasn't the 3 hours part, it was always and very clearly the 9 hour "blackout" period to rest uninterrupted so we're not on what would otherwise be a 24 hour acknowledgement quasi short call. I think SD is very, very smart. But for him to whip out the 2 hour fantasy leash isn't a very good example of wit or intelligence. Its pretty transparent that he was ordered to preserve 12 hour long call concept by any means necessary so he tried to rewrite the contract unilaterally within the contraints of the mandate he was given so as to preserve existing staffing flexibility that 12 hour leashes provide, despite the fact that is now an obselete concept. This was clearly a case of "just following orders" but its still irrelevant because the company can't rewrite the contract all by itself.

If the two glasses are undrinkable, then we need another glass. This is easilly solveable by the company, they are just choosing not to constructively engage the pilot group to do it and are instead relying on unilateral fiat that borders on flat out bullying. We have to see this through though. Not only to prevent the massive concession of a 2 hour fantasy leash, which would be a QOL destroyer especially for commuters, but to avoid setting the precedent that the company can just write themselves whatever contract they want with the self granted authority of a bankruptcy judge anytime they feel there is a need. That is simply not the case.

I'm sure DALPA would pencil whip a 19 hour long call with a 9 hour leash right now, and probably a couple hours shorter with some other minor issues being addressed. But 12 is simply unworkable and a 2 hour fantasy leash isn't some great intellectual case to drink from the glass of reasonableness. Its someone slapping their nightstick in their hand while saying "dance monkey, dance".

There ya go!

forgot to bid 01-02-2014 10:06 AM

http://i.imwx.com/web/multimedia/ima...02_320x180.jpg

flyallnite 01-02-2014 11:29 AM


Originally Posted by forgot to bid (Post 1551064)

Looks like 117 will be put to the test. How are other airlines managing the reserve obligation issue?

scambo1 01-02-2014 12:02 PM


Originally Posted by gloopy (Post 1551012)
Except the fantasy memo in question is completely irrelevant. There is no 2 hour leash. Never was. The full spirit and intent of the 3 hours prior wasn't the 3 hours part, it was always and very clearly the 9 hour "blackout" period to rest uninterrupted so we're not on what would otherwise be a 24 hour acknowledgement quasi short call. I think SD is very, very smart. But for him to whip out the 2 hour fantasy leash isn't a very good example of wit or intelligence. Its pretty transparent that he was ordered to preserve 12 hour long call concept by any means necessary so he tried to rewrite the contract unilaterally within the contraints of the mandate he was given so as to preserve existing staffing flexibility that 12 hour leashes provide, despite the fact that is now an obselete concept. This was clearly a case of "just following orders" but its still irrelevant because the company can't rewrite the contract all by itself.

If the two glasses are undrinkable, then we need another glass. This is easilly solveable by the company, they are just choosing not to constructively engage the pilot group to do it and are instead relying on unilateral fiat that borders on flat out bullying. We have to see this through though. Not only to prevent the massive concession of a 2 hour fantasy leash, which would be a QOL destroyer especially for commuters, but to avoid setting the precedent that the company can just write themselves whatever contract they want with the self granted authority of a bankruptcy judge anytime they feel there is a need. That is simply not the case.

I'm sure DALPA would pencil whip a 19 hour long call with a 9 hour leash right now, and probably a couple hours shorter with some other minor issues being addressed. But 12 is simply unworkable and a 2 hour fantasy leash isn't some great intellectual case to drink from the glass of reasonableness. Its someone slapping their nightstick in their hand while saying "dance monkey, dance".

If you think 117 reserve is a QOL hit for commuters, it becomes impossibly bad for ULH reserve commuters. The new rest requirement pre-short call for ULH means they cannot back to back short call. That's a sharp stick in the eye for commuting to reserve ULH. I predict 777 reserve to go either junior or to non commuters.

So, my previous question about rolling thunder became moot...there's no way I'd voluntarily commute to reserve again.


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