That's the way I understand it. Just like when they put hours under GS/IA pay.

Denny

 

Careful with that. There's still confusion on this basic, FAR critical issue.

You are required by law to have 10 hours of rest that also includes an 8 hour uninterrupted sleep opportunity. While the last part of that isn't strictly defined, it in no theoretical way possible can be 8 hours "behind the door". Barely 8 behind the door is therefore 100% illegal.

If something happens they will investigate everything, including your recorded key card entry to your room. If you have 8.0 hours "behind the door" then its not scientifically possible for you to have gotten an 8.0 sleep opportunity. You will ALWAYS need more than 8.0 behind the door to even be legal in theory. Even an aggressive, borderline narcoleptic will need at least 15-30 minutes on each side of the 8.0 required sleep opportunity for hygiene/bathroom/changing clothes/etc, and the vast majority of humans will need a little more with at least a slight reasonable wind down/wake up time.

It would be really hard to defend anything less than 9.0 behind the door when you think about it. Even that only gives you 30 minutes of consciousness on either side of your sleep opportunity for any and all physiological, hygienic and basic personal needs. That's likely the absolute bare minimum even possible in theory.

8.0 hours behind the doors illegal.

 

That is above all other pay. Once the rotation says closed it will stick. The new reroute section has been very good to me and a lot of other pilots. I hear the company is not happy with how much they are paying out in reroute pay. Look for them to try and revert back to the older rules next contract.

 

All well and good, I was quoting from the scheduling reference handbook. Perhaps ALPA should update with this guidance. For reference, I am using revision 5 of the update dated June 2017, page 98.

 

Yep. ALPA put out incredibly bad advice on this critical FAR issue. In no way possible is 8 hours behind the door the same as 8 hours uninterrupted sleep opportunity. That was an incredibly irresponsible and false interpretation and they need to retract it immediately.

The FAR's state 10 rest with 8 uninterrupted sleep opportunity. 8 behind the door is not sufficient for that legal requirement under any possible context. More is always required by law.

 

I like the new flight ops memo that says the GA kin care law doesn't apply and they are planning to challenge the ones in CA WA and MN. Nothing like taking care of your people Steve!!!

 

I just read it. ALPA needs to get on this right away.

 

Does the law say "sleep" opportunity, or "rest" opportunity?

 

This will only expand across the country. They know that. Instead of honoring the law and the laws of states where pilot bases are, they will make ALPA negotiate for it. It's coming, no reason to just hand it to the biggest base if the lawyers say they can stall it until negotiations.

Our future, our fight. ...unless we don't like the resultant legislation.

 

"SLEEP" This is directly out of the reg.