Good post.

+1 Bar. Great Post Tomcat! That is very well put. I could not have said it better myself.


As for CPS being sold. Well DAL is always looking for a way to raise cash and RJET would love to buy them. Heck SKW would love to buy em too. I am sure they would sell OH first, but there really are no buyers for them.

It is all about the cash flow.

All I said is I would love to know what goodies are going to be dropped Thursday. They are at the decision point for the fall schedule and the numbers are just not there.

The answer is YES. Without question.

Carl

Carl;
Before we point and shot the gun, IMHO it might be wise to make sure that the we cannot save the cow.

You know we can change the bylaws et al. We as union members have that power.

Well, speaking on behalf of many, we're on pins and needles now ACL.

As to Tomcat, I'd like him to replace Lee. But unfortunately after talking to a few Captains that were former union reps its hard to want to encourage someone to go into one of those positions. An ER CA said it rather bluntly to me in that the pilots don't always come first and thus you spend more time butting heads with entrenched insiders then getting things done for pilots and so he quit. It makes me appreciate the guys who do it but it doesn't encourage me to join in yet but I'm ready to listen, sign petitions and vote. :D

I have no info whatsoever, I am just as curious as the next one. They may decided nothing, but they need to finalize the fall schedule soon. It will get better, but the question is whether it is soon enough to let the current plan ride.

IMHO another 5% cut would not be a surprise.

Ah Slow,
I heard that too. The word was that the company was quite suprised with ALPA's proposal to terminate the pension.

Your right I haven't been here since 1926, but long enough to know how negotiations work. FYI I did recognize the C2K improvements.

Let the courts enforce it. I just don't want the language in my contract.

In the words of my favorite President "There you go again." The courts did not terminate our pension. WE agreed to it.

Exactly! Now you're getting my point (not). It was AA that started the avalanche, we were just the snow in the way.

Dude I've got an ex-wife so I don't like courts any more than you. That's why we need to bring the total costs of ALL the ALPA carriers up! As long as you maintain that attitude and if, it spreads, NO SOUP FOR YOU!

Again I think you missed my point. It should not be UAL-ALPA vs DAL-ALPA vs APA. We need to bring up pilot labor costs at all the carriers and quit letting the companies use negative pattern bargaining on us. How low are you willing to go?

PS- Lighten up a bit man.

Let's be real clear here. ALPA never made a proposal to terminate the pension. I'm sure the company would have been quite surprised, as that would have been an illegal act over which the company and ALPA have no authority to negotiate. Only one person can terminate the pension, and that's the bankruptcy judge. PBGC then gets to tell the judge whether or not the plan meets the ERISA standard for termination.

For your scenario to be true, ALPA, Delta management, the Creditors Committee, the Bankruptcy Judge and the PBGC would all have to be in cahoots and acting against the law. I'm sure the PBGC liked covering all those Delta losses with $7 stock.

Right....

I will if you will.

You quit bashing your fellow pilots and union. You quit making blanket incorrect statements about the conduct and results of your fellow pilots and union.

I'll grab an umbrella drink and head to a Cabo all inclusive!:D

Deal?

btw, you're wrong on the pension comment above (we didn't negotiate it away), but you're right on the negative effects of downward pattern bargaining.

See, we can agree!:)