Originally Posted by Sink r8 (Post 1178119)

You can't bring yourself to say it, can you?

Originally Posted by Delta1067 (Post 1178259)

Did I ever say we shouldn't? No. I just wasn't following his logic on how a "widebody" FO at Delta only makes $7700 per month so he clarified with a bunch of fuzzy numbers. Never said we shouldn't make more and I'm all for demanding big raises and scope improvements on contract 2012.

Originally Posted by Delta1067 (Post 1178259)

Did I ever say we shouldn't? No. I just wasn't following his logic on how a "widebody" FO at Delta only makes $7700 per month so he clarified with a bunch of fuzzy numbers. Never said we shouldn't make more and I'm all for demanding big raises and scope improvements on contract 2012.

Originally Posted by caddis (Post 1178267)

Sink,

I think you mistook what I meant. The day I started at NWA they had 4 year captains and I would have retired near single digits. After 9/11 I get furloughed twice. I never applied at Delta, I don't remember why, but 13 or so years later I am wearing a double breasted uniform.

All I am saying is the picture of the airline industry today is much different the it was 10years ago and will be 10years from now.

But here is something we can for sure agree on. I will not vote for any scope sale that further erodes my career.

Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp (Post 1178271)

His math was right on.

If you are in the ER category, you are a widebody FO as anytime you walk out to that gate there could be a one sitting there. Don't sell yourself short.

Originally Posted by freightguy (Post 1178261)

I agree with you about middle east. I cannot and do not want to live my entire career there. Same with my buddy who pulled the plug and went to Korean. But he got that opportunity because he left Delta and 'invested' few years in the sandpit. Good for him. I don't know how his schedules and days off work for him at Korean. He said he flies two long haul trips a month.

About job security, yes... these foreign companies can fire you in an instant if you **** them off. But with heavy left seat time, you can easily find a new gig in today's market. But then again, you get fired here too if you do stupid stuff.

Don't get me wrong tsquare. I would ideally want to work here at my home in the US for my entire career. But not for the current rates and career progression outlook. I have lived in the Far East before and I would do that again as my plan B, if they offer a deal which suits me and my family better.

Delta will have to sweeten the pot for people like me to stay. With all the retirements over the horizon and the record low numbers of commercial pilots graduating, we will have the ball in our court soon. The minimums at the regionals are going up too. But they are not going to hand out candy for free. We have to fight for it. If we accept the current status quo, they will take advantage of our pilot group again. There is no need for us to keep handing out milk for cheap.

Good luck to both you and me, and all other Delta pilots!

Originally Posted by Timbo (Post 1178281)

Could you ask your buddy what starting pay is, for a 777 Capt. at both Emirates and Korean please? I've heard lots of different numbers but only from guys who never worked at either one. Since your friend has been at both, he would know.

Also, do they pay them 'by the hour' or is it a set rate, per month, and they can fly them up to xx hours per month?

Thanks.

Tsquared, No, I'm not thinking of going...yet...just wondering what the rest of the world pays them, compared to DAL's 777 Capt. rate, which today is about $226/hr. But in 2004, it was $319/hr. We have a long way to go, to get back to that!

Originally Posted by Timbo (Post 1178281)

Could you ask your buddy what starting pay is, for a 777 Capt. at both Emirates and Korean please? I've heard lots of different numbers but only from guys who never worked at either one. Since your friend has been at both, he would know.

Also, do they pay them 'by the hour' or is it a set rate, per month, and they can fly them up to xx hours per month?

Thanks.

Tsquared, No, I'm not thinking of going...yet...just wondering what the rest of the world pays them, compared to DAL's 777 Capt. rate, which today is about $226/hr. But in 2004, it was $319/hr. We have a long way to go, to get back to that!

Originally Posted by freightguy (Post 1178285)

Timbo, I just shot him an e-mail. I will get back to you in a couple of days.