If you care so intently about your family and friends, perhaps you should have managed your personal finances better. If foregoing an 8% raise places your loved ones in a precarious financial position then then you have no one to blame, but yourself.

A word to the wise.....Incongruent hypothetical arguments prove a meaningless point.

Whereas, turning down C2015 cost the pilots group over $1.1 billion that will never be recoverable....is no different than saying.....accepting C2012 cost the pilot group an additional $1.1 billion that could/should have been negotiated and will never been recouped.

Side note....Most pilots don't feel the need to defend their self worth, but if you are truly a pilot, then what is Vzt Speed?

 

I really am a pilot but have no idea what Vzt is and forgot the spin BF years ago, thank God. Also being a new hire I didn't have a vote so I was just an interested bystander. But when it came to the money in TA15 it appeared to me (and Wall St.) to be a self funded raise. That being said it would be a no anyway, because that is just stupid. It's not like we are hemorrhaging money and headed for BK.

I think the 8/6/3/3 would have been fine if the PS was left alone. If they want to get away from PS then just give us an 15% raise PLUS 8/6/3/3. That is a called compromise, it's not all about concessions.

Just an opine from a probie, just saying.

 

Sadly, you do not have the historic facts. So, you cannot be expected to make a rational decision. You arrived on the doorstep with what is currently on the buffet table.

Why would you be willing to trade profit sharing that is worth 21-22% this year for a 15% raise (which is actually a 6% compensation cut)? Are you defective?

Talk to the captains you fly with and get educated about what was taken from the pilot group. You really haven't earned an opinion on the topic...to be blunt.

When you are off probation, you will get a vote. Make it an educated vote...not an "it's better than the military" vote.

This is commercial aviation. I don't do this job pro bono. I do it to get paid.

 

I'm not really a pilot, I'm a lesbian ocean racer trapped in a male pilot's body!

Before I joined Delta to pretend I'm a pilot, I was a prostitute, so I know a lot about getting phucked. Those of us who have worked here for more than 20 years gave up 42% of our pay and ALL of our retirement, to "Save Delta".

Delta is now making more money in 90 days, than they ever have in the history of the World. They could easily afford to restore our concessions now that the threat of Bankruptcy is over.

Instead, they chose to spend $6 Billion on stock buybacks and dividends and to try to screw us with another Cost Neutral TA.

And they wonder why sick leave is up?

What goes around comes around.

 

Lol, I have an answer for you when you "think" anyone is "taking" something from you and yours, GOOD. If you are so short sighted and selfish to think that way, GOOD.

So every 15th and 30th, remember GOOD.

 

The only place I'm willing to trade profit sharing is for 20% defined benefit in my 401k. That'd make it somewhere around 35% per year, now that's a retirement!

With this trade to the 401k, or not touching the profit sharing at all, I'm fine with the raise they presented last time that returned us to 2k rates uncorrected for inflation. 8/6/3/3 is fine to me too, but don't fund it with my PS.

2007 hire, with a vote, and I just put the above numbers in my DALPA survey. My last vote was no, and I've never been anything but glad I voted that way. I'm looking forward to my full profit sharing check next year. I echo the opine that it is ridiculous to fund our own raises with profit sharing. I won't accept any reduction in profit sharing for pay.

 

415C! I'm going to make this point because many of us (including me) embrace the concept of more $$ in our defined contribution plan. I like it so much I have been maxing my personal contribution, even back in the "good ole days" when I had a pension too. Unfortunately various limits imposed under Section 415 of the IRS code constrain the amount of contributions we can make in different ways, but the biggie is $53,000. Many wide body F/Os and most captains are already hitting that ceiling. Excess contributions get converted to regular wages and taxed as such. So $200,000 in regular compensation would net a theoretical $70,000 given your 35% example. The excess $17,000 would really be a reshuffle of pay, unfortunately. I say all the foregoing as a novice, and I'm open for correction. Anybody know how we could get more qualified retirement in our hands, shy of a pension? I'm assuming that the annuity idea that's floating around is subject to the same limits as our current plan.

Anyhow TCM, I like the way you think. It would be nice if we could make it reality.

 

Thanks for your input. The only exception I take is in bold above. While I do not consider myself defective I am sure many do. That being said are you "defective" enough to think that these profits will continue until the end of your career? I am guessing that over time 15%+- would prove to be above PS into the future. Maybe I'm out to lunch. I am admittedly late to the party.

 

I'm a doooosh sometimes...even when I don't mean to be.

The company has no problem taking away pay rates when times get tough. I'm not interested in helping them do that by devaluing PS and also making it a pay rate.

The beauty of PS is that it works in good and bad times...in bad times, it has no value so it stays in the contract. In good times it pays in addition to rates.

My seat pays $35-40/hr less that it paid in 2004 un corrected for inflation. BTW, that is up significantly from its low.

 

I think the annuity idea skirts the irs 415c contribution rule.