Originally Posted by adspilot

Why would a reserve do a back to back CDO? Unless it takes him into his last day for an early release.

It doesn't make sense that a reserve guy would pick up a back to back CDO.

Originally Posted by AdiosMikeFox

Yeah, I don't get what he's saying either. A 4 day CDO trip is 3 duty nights which would leave two rest periods between those 3 CDO's. I don't see how a single hotel covers anything in that situation.

Originally Posted by cr700

I don't know what "propaganda" you are talking about, but Envoy has 28 new hires this month. Do you think that those new hires would be coming here if everything was as bad as the picture you paint? No.

They are coming here because they realize Envoy has turned the corner and is the only place to go if you want a guaranteed mainline job in 6 years.



You could go to a Mesa, TSA, Gojets or wherever and get that quick upgrade, get your 1000 PIC and sit there for 10 years before even an LCC might call you. I've got news for you. Envoy's upgrade is projected at about 2.5 years for someone hired today. So, I don't know how quick that upgrade at another bottom of the barrel company is really that much quicker than if you came to Envoy. Then, instead of waiting around 10 years to get hired at maybe an LCC, you go straight to the largest major airline in the world in 6 years. I don't know how you think you can beat that.



You may have heard but Republic is having trouble meeting their AA flight schedule. We are expecting some of their 175's to come here. Envoy continues to add to projected fleet count. Right now, we are at 155 aircraft by years end. That's about 15 above where we were projected to be by year end 2016. Not if, but when some of Republic's aircraft start showing up here, you'll see that fleet count continue to rise. With the 175 options out there, I wouldn't be surprised to see Envoy's fleet count get near 200 again at some point. It's obvious PSA isn't able to staff our CRJ's so I would expect those to continue being deferred indefinitely. Right now, they are deferred through the end of the year but unless PSA starts getting big numbers through the door, they aren't going anywhere.



All this means is many more Captain slots here at Envoy further dropping the upgrade time. And the flow continues unabated. We've already been notified that the flow isn't going to stop as Letter T pilots return to AA. Even flowing a few less this year and then getting back up to full speed next year still gets a new hire over to AA in six years.



You really need to evaluate what you post when you don't have facts.

Originally Posted by highflyer1980

So you are telling us that the recruiters are right now telling these new hires that our contract gets violated everyday, and they still want to fly here? Come on man. I know for a fact they leave that information out of the interviews and recruiting events.

Recruiting 101....Always tell them the best things. Never mention the worst.

I'm willing to bet money that none of these new hires know exactly what goes on here. They just know we fly jets, we pay them to fly, and they are jets.

Originally Posted by use2fly

I don't disagree with your points. But do you believe any other regional out there is any different while recruiting?

Originally Posted by PilotCrusader

A - That doesn't make it any more right.
B - Even more reason for a prospective new hire to educate themselves beyond the used car salesmen.

Originally Posted by use2fly

I don't think it makes it right at all. It just seems that all the haters point to envoy doing this as if no other regional does.

Originally Posted by PilotCrusader

I think plenty of other regionals have gotten called out too. Here on APC, I don't really see any other management types of other regionals making desperate propaganda claims.

For a while, PSA was getting a little out of hand. I actively tried to reason that the music would stop sooner than later and that the were trying to dupe people into coming to a short upgrade that math said was already over for those hired then. In the end, I was right too.

So don't go with the "it's not fair because they are only picking on me argument". Next.

Originally Posted by chrisreedrules

The music stopped because the company messed up big time by killing its own momentum with hiring. They completely stopped hiring FOs to hire a bunch of direct entry CAs that honestly, didn't really end up needing to be hired in the first place. Nothing against those guys of course, but they took jobs away from FOs who would of been qualified within a couple months anyway. We could of kept hiring, flow numbers would of increased, we would of already announced another new base, etc... But that's not how it went down. Now we're stagnant because we can barely keep up hiring for attrition, which means we can't take any more of your 700s (which honestly, at the risk of opening that can of worms, no one here is that upset about), which means upgrades have stopped. But hey, that's how the cookie crumbles. I'm happy where I'm at, but if I were a new FO getting into the industry today, I probably wouldn't even be looking at any of the AAG wholly owned regionals. They have all been mismanaged and will likely continue to be mismanaged along with some of the lowest pay.

Originally Posted by PilotCrusader

Regardless, the music stopped. More importantly, the "spin" coming at new hires was just that. Now they are trying even harder to run the propaganda machine at envoy.
"Flow flow flow! Pay no attention to daily life here at envoy, and anyone who tries to tell you it isn't awesome is a lying hater!!"