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Old 01-21-2023, 04:25 PM
  #111  
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Originally Posted by Globemaster2827 View Post
Exactly. You need to have a VERY good reason with hard known facts to change airlines. This time next year we may be hiring and they may be furloughing. If you left now you'd be trying to get a job at a regional while you're furloughed when you would've been a Captain at FedEx with a new TA. I was worried about 4a2c in early March of 2020 and then I spent every day on Reserve getting used thanks to Covid. All of the sudden there was unlimited flying and money to be made.

Everyone needs to just relax and enjoy their lives. This too shall pass.
Iíll relax and enjoy my life when we have an industry leading contract which compensates me for the type of flying Iíve been doing, under the circumstances Iíve been flying, from a company that makes BILLIONS consistently. Thanks for the advice though.
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Old 01-21-2023, 04:48 PM
  #112  
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Originally Posted by windshearmaxthr View Post
I understand that, and thatís great but you are comparing rates of a TA to our expired contract rates. I would hope our WB scale exceeds theirs and our narrow body exceed their 757/767-300 scale. Anything other than that would be a resounding no for most here I would imagine. Maybe not who knows.

Im just pointing out that many are under the assumption that new hire Delta pilots are upgrading straight to WB aircraft and thatís not necessarily the full picture when you look at the pay rates associated with each aircraft there.
Of course we are comparing our current rates to their TA. Thatís precisely how pattern bargaining works! If we only compared our current rates to their old ones, we spied never advance. Until we come in higher, itíll continue to show our lag. And the fact that their new 767 rate is the same as their 757 and yet itís still better than our WB rate makes their case better, especially since their new hires are upgrading into a rate that is higher than our WB captain rates.

Originally Posted by Globemaster2827 View Post
Exactly. You need to have a VERY good reason with hard known facts to change airlines. This time next year we may be hiring and they may be furloughing. If you left now you'd be trying to get a job at a regional while you're furloughed when you would've been a Captain at FedEx with a new TA. I was worried about 4a2c in early March of 2020 and then I spent every day on Reserve getting used thanks to Covid. All of the sudden there was unlimited flying and money to be made.

Everyone needs to just relax and enjoy their lives. This too shall pass.
Wait, why would someone leaving now to delta be trying to get a job a at regional?

Why do pilots say talking points that sound like what management would say at the bargaining table?
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Old 01-21-2023, 04:59 PM
  #113  
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[QUOTE=FXLAX;3576548]Of course we are comparing our current rates to their TA. Thatís precisely how pattern bargaining works! If we only compared our current rates to their old ones, we spied never advance. Until we come in higher, itíll continue to show our lag. And the fact that their new 767 rate is the same as their 757 and yet itís still better than our WB rate makes their case better, especially since their new hires are upgrading into a rate that is higher than our WB captain rates.

Youíre not really seeing my point, we should accept nothing less than them.

Maybe reading my previous post to the one you quoted will add some context.

I was shedding some light on something that seems to be misinterpreted amongst many.

Last edited by windshearmaxthr; 01-21-2023 at 05:23 PM.
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Old 01-21-2023, 08:30 PM
  #114  
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[QUOTE=windshearmaxthr;3576556]
Originally Posted by FXLAX View Post
Of course we are comparing our current rates to their TA. Thatís precisely how pattern bargaining works! If we only compared our current rates to their old ones, we spied never advance. Until we come in higher, itíll continue to show our lag. And the fact that their new 767 rate is the same as their 757 and yet itís still better than our WB rate makes their case better, especially since their new hires are upgrading into a rate that is higher than our WB captain rates.

Youíre not really seeing my point, we should accept nothing less than them.

Maybe reading my previous post to the one you quoted will add some context.

I was shedding some light on something that seems to be misinterpreted amongst many.
You are right then, I donít see a different point than the one I think you are making.
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Old 01-22-2023, 12:31 AM
  #115  
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Originally Posted by FXLAX View Post
Of course we are comparing our current rates to their TA. Thatís precisely how pattern bargaining works! If we only compared our current rates to their old ones, we spied never advance. Until we come in higher, itíll continue to show our lag. And the fact that their new 767 rate is the same as their 757 and yet itís still better than our WB rate makes their case better, especially since their new hires are upgrading into a rate that is higher than our WB captain rates.



Wait, why would someone leaving now to delta be trying to get a job a at regional?

Why do pilots say talking points that sound like what management would say at the bargaining table?
Leave for Delta then if you think I'm a management plant... Enjoy your time there. In a year they'll furlough and that'll come from pilots on the bottom. Enjoy. Then you will be looking for a regional to work at. That was the point. Or you could just stay and enjoy your life. All you can do at FedEx is what you feel like helps out our NC.

Delta is super awesome though... Go have fun. I hope you've been at FedEx more than 4.5 years...
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Old 01-22-2023, 03:19 AM
  #116  
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Originally Posted by Globemaster2827 View Post
Leave for Delta then if you think I'm a management plant... Enjoy your time there. In a year they'll furlough and that'll come from pilots on the bottom. Enjoy. Then you will be looking for a regional to work at. That was the point. Or you could just stay and enjoy your life. All you can do at FedEx is what you feel like helps out our NC.

Delta is super awesome though... Go have fun. I hope you've been at FedEx more than 4.5 years...
Why would Delta furlough?

Did you live under a rock during COVID? Thousands of pilots at Delta and United received WARN letters for a possible furlough. Government money saved them. The idea that those airlines are furlough-prone is a relic of the past. If they didnít furlough during COVID I donít see another time when they would.

I have 6. And I have no qualms about pulling the plug if this place doesnít recognize the effort Iíve put into it. We spend the majority of our work life awake between 9pm and 6am, and itís an absolute gut punch. This airline should pay a premium to work here on that basis alone.
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Old 01-22-2023, 05:38 AM
  #117  
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Originally Posted by coryk View Post

I have 6. And I have no qualms about pulling the plug if this place doesnít recognize that we spend the majority of our work life awake between 9pm and 6am, and itís an absolute gut punch. This airline should pay a premium to work here on that basis alone.
Absolutely. Our bodies take a greater toll, and the company profited immensely off our backs during covid. No Concessions is a bare minimum.
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Old 01-22-2023, 05:55 AM
  #118  
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Originally Posted by coryk View Post
Why would Delta furlough?

Did you live under a rock during COVID? Thousands of pilots at Delta and United received WARN letters for a possible furlough. Government money saved them. The idea that those airlines are furlough-prone is a relic of the past. If they didnít furlough during COVID I donít see another time when they would.

I have 6. And I have no qualms about pulling the plug if this place doesnít recognize the effort Iíve put into it. We spend the majority of our work life awake between 9pm and 6am, and itís an absolute gut punch. This airline should pay a premium to work here on that basis alone.
I donít think Iíd go so far as to say furlough for pax is a relic of the past. Covid was unique due to the fact that the pandemic caused the slow down, not a recession. If there is an economic slow downÖwhich there isÖand it gets worse. Pax will stop hiring, maybe furlough. Maybe we will too, thing is, you canít know. The reason the government passed out all those dolla dolla bills was, in my opinion, an expectation of a rather quick return to normal. If you think big daddy G is gonna fork out money to the airlines to keep from furloughing in a major recession I think youíre mistaken. I still think we are more insulated from a major economic downturn than pax. But time may prove me wrongÖ.but I agree that FedEx needs to pay up!
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Old 01-22-2023, 10:09 AM
  #119  
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Originally Posted by Globemaster2827 View Post
Leave for Delta then if you think I'm a management plant... Enjoy your time there. In a year they'll furlough and that'll come from pilots on the bottom. Enjoy. Then you will be looking for a regional to work at. That was the point. Or you could just stay and enjoy your life. All you can do at FedEx is what you feel like helps out our NC.

Delta is super awesome though... Go have fun. I hope you've been at FedEx more than 4.5 years...
Why would I go anywhere just because you spew management talking points? I didn’t say you were management. I asked why pilots (you) say things management would say? Which is worse because it’s management’s job to take positions that further their contract goals. It just surprises me when I hear it from our own.

Your actual point is that you think you 100% know the future.
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Old 01-22-2023, 01:23 PM
  #120  
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Originally Posted by FXLAX View Post
Why would I go anywhere just because you spew management talking points? I didnít say you were management. I asked why pilots (you) say things management would say? Which is worse because itís managementís job to take positions that further their contract goals. It just surprises me when I hear it from our own.

Your actual point is that you think you 100% know the future.

GlobeMaster has a valid point. The constant this airline or that airline has this or that is nonsense. You have to look at a contract as a whole. Why donít you and all the other constant whiners post all the things we have that they donít? I am all for making improvements, but acting as if or saying we are industry bottom (like posters have said) is ridiculous and untruthful. Like he said, if it is so bad then see you later. Many airlines are hiring.
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