Best way to get started?
09-13-2005, 04:11 PM
#11
Guest
Posts: n/a
brav,
remember this....it is not all about getting the 1000 hours or whatever number some airline seeks. part of it is having fun, enjoying the flying, people, students, tower guys, ramp rats and such. sure you want to eventually move on, but have some damn fun on the way there.
i averaged 80-100 month, but that was at sheble's were we flew 350 days a year. you must consider where you live/work and the weather conditions you'll be dealing with. i'd guess most guys/girls fly between 40-70 hours a month but that has a lot of room for error. don't forget alot of ground school in there also. plus you want to have an opportunity to fly a twin at some point also. CFI,II,MEI are good qualifications to possess.
as far as pay goes that is as different as most schools. typically instructor are compensated by the hour with 10 bucks on the low side up to 20 dollars an hour or more. it just depends. remember that is flight time/ground....not all the time spent in the office doing paperwork, answering phones and eating doughnuts. so if you fly only 2 hours a day five days a week=$200.00 a week before taxes. you might want to make sure that the place you teach has students or you have the ability to get some......lot of Top Ramen nights.
we were/are paid salary at sheble's.....not a whole lot to start(350.00/week) but i didn't have to worry about eating every week either.
BTW i didn't get hired until I had 1800TT and 600 multi you never know what the magic # will be
remember this....it is not all about getting the 1000 hours or whatever number some airline seeks. part of it is having fun, enjoying the flying, people, students, tower guys, ramp rats and such. sure you want to eventually move on, but have some damn fun on the way there.
i averaged 80-100 month, but that was at sheble's were we flew 350 days a year. you must consider where you live/work and the weather conditions you'll be dealing with. i'd guess most guys/girls fly between 40-70 hours a month but that has a lot of room for error. don't forget alot of ground school in there also. plus you want to have an opportunity to fly a twin at some point also. CFI,II,MEI are good qualifications to possess.
as far as pay goes that is as different as most schools. typically instructor are compensated by the hour with 10 bucks on the low side up to 20 dollars an hour or more. it just depends. remember that is flight time/ground....not all the time spent in the office doing paperwork, answering phones and eating doughnuts. so if you fly only 2 hours a day five days a week=$200.00 a week before taxes. you might want to make sure that the place you teach has students or you have the ability to get some......lot of Top Ramen nights.
we were/are paid salary at sheble's.....not a whole lot to start(350.00/week) but i didn't have to worry about eating every week either.
BTW i didn't get hired until I had 1800TT and 600 multi you never know what the magic # will be
09-13-2005, 05:15 PM
#12
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2005
Position: CRJ-900 FO, Supra left seat
Posts: 303
I have been working as a CFI/MEI for a flight school I training at myself, Trade Winds. Flight time can range from 60 hrs per week to 2 hrs per week. Remember to teach at a location where the weather does not change drastically. During the late summer months no one wants to fly because you'll get heat-stroke while doing touch and goes; unless you bring a 2 liter of water with you (figure it into weight and balance!) 
During the "fall, winter, and spring" months you will not have time to sit for 10 minutes between flights for days upon days on end. I have logged 400 in 12 months so far (including my training at "Flight Safety" less than 12 mo's ago)..... and about 300 in the past 6 mo's. You will get your flight time pretty quickly as a CFI/MEI at a local FBO. Don't forget to get your CFII and MEI RIGHT AWAY so you can teach every SINGLE person that walks through the door of your flight school. I highly suggest a "Mom and Pop's Shop" like Trade Winds. You won't be disappointed when you learn there, or when you teach there; I make 20/hr for private pilots and 25/hr for advanced training. Also remember that you will deal with aircraft that are maintained similarly to actual airline aircraft, not these "airline career schools" maint where everything is spick and spam and you dont fly unless that landing light works! You will learn what it means to fly in the REAL WORLD not some dream land where everything is perfect. Anyhow, I wish the best with your career, if you decide to persue it. Don't forget your diploma!
Best Regards,
Jason Leonard
During the "fall, winter, and spring" months you will not have time to sit for 10 minutes between flights for days upon days on end. I have logged 400 in 12 months so far (including my training at "Flight Safety" less than 12 mo's ago)..... and about 300 in the past 6 mo's. You will get your flight time pretty quickly as a CFI/MEI at a local FBO. Don't forget to get your CFII and MEI RIGHT AWAY so you can teach every SINGLE person that walks through the door of your flight school. I highly suggest a "Mom and Pop's Shop" like Trade Winds. You won't be disappointed when you learn there, or when you teach there; I make 20/hr for private pilots and 25/hr for advanced training. Also remember that you will deal with aircraft that are maintained similarly to actual airline aircraft, not these "airline career schools" maint where everything is spick and spam and you dont fly unless that landing light works! You will learn what it means to fly in the REAL WORLD not some dream land where everything is perfect. Anyhow, I wish the best with your career, if you decide to persue it. Don't forget your diploma!Best Regards,
Jason Leonard
09-14-2005, 04:21 AM
#14
Self Employed.
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Corporate Pilot
Posts: 7,119
CFI Pay
Lest not forget to mention that CFI's only get paid when they are with a student. 20/hr sounds like a lot of money to most people, but you could sit there all day and have one student show up and the plane be grounded due to a mechanical. You just made nothin man !! Then there are 8 hour days, but it is not constant and it varies with the season.
SkyHigh
SkyHigh
09-14-2005, 04:38 AM
#15
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2005
Position: CRJ-900 FO, Supra left seat
Posts: 303
Flight time Vs. Hourly Rates / Weather
Exactly! You have to go with the flow when it comes to wages. The only reason I have time to do this post thing is because I have no students for the day.... for the 3rd day in a row! It's funny how it goes from insanely busy to incredibly dead. I have taken this time to examine my options as a PROFESSIONAL pilot (no offense to any and all cfi's) and move on soon. Remember to get all the ratings you can before you receive students and a huge workload and then do not have the time to do your CFII and MEI. Those are very important ratings that airlines want to see that you acheived, whether or not you ended up using your CFII (which you will!).
From what I have experienced of Tucson, AZ.... it is "moderately hot" in the summer time during the day (100+ daily, not no humidity!)... and "winter cold" according to my floridian skin at night. Good weather seems to be the overrulling phenomena. I recommend it over FL because of experience with IFR conditions during the morning hours, etc, unless you come down here in the "fall/winter/spring" time. We really dont get too much of a season change down here! Hope this helps!
Best Regards,
Jason Leonard
From what I have experienced of Tucson, AZ.... it is "moderately hot" in the summer time during the day (100+ daily, not no humidity!)... and "winter cold" according to my floridian skin at night. Good weather seems to be the overrulling phenomena. I recommend it over FL because of experience with IFR conditions during the morning hours, etc, unless you come down here in the "fall/winter/spring" time. We really dont get too much of a season change down here! Hope this helps!
Best Regards,
Jason Leonard
09-14-2005, 07:01 AM
#16
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2005
Position: B767/757 CAPT
Posts: 146
If you're absolutely serious about flying, here's what worked for me.
Keep going know matter how hard it gets. I went to college for a different career until I realized I wanted to try being a pilot. I also checked in to the High Priced "Aviation Acadamies" but found out that $40,000 was too much to pay in 1 year. I went to my local flight school and worked my way thru. I put some of the flying on low interest credit cards and paid my way thru the rest of it ( my parents also helped out as much as they could) After I got my Instrument rating, I joined a flying club to get a better rate while I was working on getting my 250 hrs for the Commercial ticket. After that I tried flying skydivers instead if getting my Cfi. That lasted 2 weeks. I got my CFI and CFII and started instructing. I was lucky enough to teach at a flight school that also had a charter company with Cessna 421s and King Air 200s. I flew co-pilot trips to build my Multi time. After a year and a half, I became a Captain on the 421 and then soon after that a captain on the King air. I flew part 135 charter for 3 years until the airlines started hiring again. I got hired with a regional airline 6 months ago and the rest is history.
I have 2 years of college with no degree and I don't have any flying debt.
My advice would be to just stay focused and keep working towards the next certificate or rating. Even when the road seems impossible to finish, stay with it. At times it is definetely a job, but it is still better than going to work 5 days a week in an office.
Here are a couple of websites that helped me along the way:
www.jetcareers.com
www.studentpilot.net
www.aviationinterviews.com
Keep going know matter how hard it gets. I went to college for a different career until I realized I wanted to try being a pilot. I also checked in to the High Priced "Aviation Acadamies" but found out that $40,000 was too much to pay in 1 year. I went to my local flight school and worked my way thru. I put some of the flying on low interest credit cards and paid my way thru the rest of it ( my parents also helped out as much as they could) After I got my Instrument rating, I joined a flying club to get a better rate while I was working on getting my 250 hrs for the Commercial ticket. After that I tried flying skydivers instead if getting my Cfi. That lasted 2 weeks. I got my CFI and CFII and started instructing. I was lucky enough to teach at a flight school that also had a charter company with Cessna 421s and King Air 200s. I flew co-pilot trips to build my Multi time. After a year and a half, I became a Captain on the 421 and then soon after that a captain on the King air. I flew part 135 charter for 3 years until the airlines started hiring again. I got hired with a regional airline 6 months ago and the rest is history.
I have 2 years of college with no degree and I don't have any flying debt.
My advice would be to just stay focused and keep working towards the next certificate or rating. Even when the road seems impossible to finish, stay with it. At times it is definetely a job, but it is still better than going to work 5 days a week in an office.
Here are a couple of websites that helped me along the way:
www.jetcareers.com
www.studentpilot.net
www.aviationinterviews.com
09-14-2005, 03:21 PM
#18
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by SkyHigh
Why do you want to be an airline pilot? I understand that you don't have a family or responsibilities, but do you ever wish to have those things? The airlines are becoming increasingly difficult to become gainfully employed at. The average new hire at a regional has about 150K invested for a job that pays 18K. I don't mean to discourage you, but aviation isn't really a job anymore. It is more of a working hobby that requires a lot from its subjects. If I were you I would consider buying a plane or starting at a local small flight school to see if you like it or not. Get your PVT and if the price of that doesnt scare you then move ahead. I wouldn't jump into an expensive airline school. You never stop paying in aviation so you had better get use to it if you plan to make a career out of it. After flight school and college then there are type ratings, training contracts and a decade or more of low paying jobs.
SkyHigh
SkyHigh
09-16-2005, 04:53 AM
#19
New Hire
Joined APC: Sep 2005
Posts: 1
It's Not All that Bad
Why do you want to be an airline pilot? I understand that you don't have a family or responsibilities, but do you ever wish to have those things? The airlines are becoming increasingly difficult to become gainfully employed at. The average new hire at a regional has about 150K invested for a job that pays 18K. I don't mean to discourage you, but aviation isn't really a job anymore. It is more of a working hobby that requires a lot from its subjects. If I were you I would consider buying a plane or starting at a local small flight school to see if you like it or not. Get your PVT and if the price of that doesnt scare you then move ahead. I wouldn't jump into an expensive airline school. You never stop paying in aviation so you had better get use to it if you plan to make a career out of it. After flight school and college then there are type ratings, training contracts and a decade or more of low paying jobs.
SkyHigh
I Would Just like to let everyone know out there that Mr SkyHigh is incorrect, Every pilot starting out has to live like a very poor man, that has alwways been the situation from Day 1. Airlines just aren't what they used to be...meaning work a few days off many, companies want more out of a pilot now thats all, if you can stand being away, then aviation can be a very rewarding career, you just have to work hard to get where you want to be, so don't let Mr. SkyHigh discourage anyone. AIRLINE FLYING IS STILL A VERY REWARDING CAREER, AND IS STILL A JOB
SkyHigh
I Would Just like to let everyone know out there that Mr SkyHigh is incorrect, Every pilot starting out has to live like a very poor man, that has alwways been the situation from Day 1. Airlines just aren't what they used to be...meaning work a few days off many, companies want more out of a pilot now thats all, if you can stand being away, then aviation can be a very rewarding career, you just have to work hard to get where you want to be, so don't let Mr. SkyHigh discourage anyone. AIRLINE FLYING IS STILL A VERY REWARDING CAREER, AND IS STILL A JOB
09-16-2005, 06:44 AM
#20
Self Employed.
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Corporate Pilot
Posts: 7,119
Aviation
Todd Man
My only point is that people who are considering aviation as a career are swamped with inaccurate and overly positive information. They read Flying Magazine and are convinced that they are all going to be rich 747 Captains within a few years. I feel that it is important to show the down side of making that choice. I say look at AOPA's pilot numbers. The number of new Commercial pilots created every year is much bigger than the number of new jobs. Aviation can be a rewarding career but the odds are that it will leave most disappointed and deeply in debt.
SkyHigh
My only point is that people who are considering aviation as a career are swamped with inaccurate and overly positive information. They read Flying Magazine and are convinced that they are all going to be rich 747 Captains within a few years. I feel that it is important to show the down side of making that choice. I say look at AOPA's pilot numbers. The number of new Commercial pilots created every year is much bigger than the number of new jobs. Aviation can be a rewarding career but the odds are that it will leave most disappointed and deeply in debt.
SkyHigh
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