JetBlue Latest and Greatest
10-19-2016, 12:57 PM
#1491
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2011
Position: CA
Posts: 1,027
Originally Posted by txbusdriver
Because up until now it didn't make sense for me to leave. Top 20% in the company, less than 20 years to go....
Well, all legacies are in a hiring quite a bit. Now is your chance to get out and get on with a real airline, before it's too late
10-19-2016, 04:26 PM
#1493
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,206
Originally Posted by CaptCoolHand
ok... Not sure about your point? It's the way they calculate the PS. It will be going from 15% to 10%. Change Via Email... oops did we send that?
I'm aware of what PS was a few years ago. I got the $11.73. .02% sent it to the BPF...
They are going to change the system of how they calculate PS. To less.
The union has said, take the free money and holiday pay days did it not?
Take the hourly rate increase.
I simply don't understand the argument against this LOA.
I'm aware of what PS was a few years ago. I got the $11.73. .02% sent it to the BPF...
They are going to change the system of how they calculate PS. To less.
The union has said, take the free money and holiday pay days did it not?
Take the hourly rate increase.
I simply don't understand the argument against this LOA.
His point is that the 15% is an anomaly, and saying that the 8% is really 3% assumes that the 15% profit sharing would continue. This LOA not only codifies the 10%, which is good, but it also gives an 8% bump in base pay. Sure, if profit sharing were going to be 15% forever, this pay raise would be smaller, but there is never a guarantee with PS.
The company even says that this LOA moves pay from not guaranteed profit sharing to guaranteed base pay. Even if it were 1 for 1, that's a good thing for us.
Yes, it's also a PR move from the company, but so what? We take our 8% and continue negotiating.
10-20-2016, 03:59 PM
#1495
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2016
Posts: 591
Originally Posted by Southerner
His point is that the 15% is an anomaly, and saying that the 8% is really 3% assumes that the 15% profit sharing would continue. This LOA not only codifies the 10%, which is good, but it also gives an 8% bump in base pay. Sure, if profit sharing were going to be 15% forever, this pay raise would be smaller, but there is never a guarantee with PS.
The company even says that this LOA moves pay from not guaranteed profit sharing to guaranteed base pay. Even if it were 1 for 1, that's a good thing for us.
Yes, it's also a PR move from the company, but so what? We take our 8% and continue negotiating.
The company even says that this LOA moves pay from not guaranteed profit sharing to guaranteed base pay. Even if it were 1 for 1, that's a good thing for us.
Yes, it's also a PR move from the company, but so what? We take our 8% and continue negotiating.
Also the LOA does nothing to guarantee no further changes because the LOA references a formula in the Plan. The plan has no formula to reference. Doubt that? Look it up and find it.
Hint: it's not there.
Moving pay from profit sharing only works if pay is tied to the leading base pay plus XX%. Right now we have 30% lagging base pay and our PS was just cut and no work rules, health at will, retirement at will no time off, etc. Also the De minimis years would have netted no less than 4% Profit Sharing if it wasn't stolen for retirement. Without the PS in the retirement plan we would have 8%. The company thinks 5+3 = 13 and so do many of my fellow Jetblue pilots on this forum.
Not a good thing.
Last edited by BlueJetDork; 10-20-2016 at 04:09 PM.
10-20-2016, 04:11 PM
#1496
Super Moderator
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,945
Originally Posted by P-3Bubba
Just voted NO to the 8% temptation offer by management. Go ahead and vote yes but you are part of the problem. Touch the spindle. Touch the spindle.
-Bubs
-Bubs
10-20-2016, 05:45 PM
#1497
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Posts: 2,594
Originally Posted by P-3Bubba
AND CaptCool
We have a choice. That's this vote. We say as a group to NO/ZERO compensatory manipulation from management UNTIL we have a CBA. The Union and MEC is wrong to advise us that we should take this money. It will be a quid pro quo when the CBA and compensation is hashed out. Especially in regards to back-pay. We are essentially signing a 2017 PEA with this LOA. Just like in 2013 when we all saw the roses on the 13% raise but the bud fell off our premium trigger. Take some and you lose some.
TXBus is saying that jetblue is a joke. The Union vote was supposed to increase our relevance as a pilot group vying for A320 and Major Airline wages. This further supports the NO argument as complete solidarity against management until we have a CBA. If this LOA passes (and it will) the company knows our first TA will pass. So they'll make up a $hit sandwich and serve it up with no retro pay, no international rates, no healthcare changes and maybe a 8% no match 401k in their newly negotiated low cost Empower Financial account of their choosing. (BTW, 8% is the 5% they already match plus the 3% profit share you just lost= COST NUETRAL)
I agree that you can find a percentage of new hire pilots that would be less attractive to the Legacy carriers. But, that's their decision. I'm not sure how we resolve that situation, nor do I see it as a positive or negative game changer to the company.
ALPA has the slogan "Contract Above All". I see this LOA appeasement as a compromise to their own slogan.
-Bubs
We have a choice. That's this vote. We say as a group to NO/ZERO compensatory manipulation from management UNTIL we have a CBA. The Union and MEC is wrong to advise us that we should take this money. It will be a quid pro quo when the CBA and compensation is hashed out. Especially in regards to back-pay. We are essentially signing a 2017 PEA with this LOA. Just like in 2013 when we all saw the roses on the 13% raise but the bud fell off our premium trigger. Take some and you lose some.
TXBus is saying that jetblue is a joke. The Union vote was supposed to increase our relevance as a pilot group vying for A320 and Major Airline wages. This further supports the NO argument as complete solidarity against management until we have a CBA. If this LOA passes (and it will) the company knows our first TA will pass. So they'll make up a $hit sandwich and serve it up with no retro pay, no international rates, no healthcare changes and maybe a 8% no match 401k in their newly negotiated low cost Empower Financial account of their choosing. (BTW, 8% is the 5% they already match plus the 3% profit share you just lost= COST NUETRAL)
I agree that you can find a percentage of new hire pilots that would be less attractive to the Legacy carriers. But, that's their decision. I'm not sure how we resolve that situation, nor do I see it as a positive or negative game changer to the company.
ALPA has the slogan "Contract Above All". I see this LOA appeasement as a compromise to their own slogan.
-Bubs
10-20-2016, 10:26 PM
#1498
Covfefe
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 3,001
Originally Posted by usmc-sgt
Your own MEC advised to vote yes on the LOA
10-21-2016, 03:36 AM
#1500
SDQ Base Chief
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: 320 CA
Posts: 5,588
Originally Posted by hockeypilot44
Are they even allowed to change your profit sharing? I thought things had to stay status quo since you guys are unionized and negotiating a contract.
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