Punkpilot48

ChrisH,

No I do understand. But saying that a bus driver has just as much responsibilty as an airline pilot is saying that the kid at McDonalds has responsibility because he could give you food poisoning. With your same argument lets pay the corperate pilots the same as taxi drivers. Yeah make them earn those tips. And cargo pilots can be paid as much as the letter carriers for US mail. You can take any job and say well all this job is a glorified way of being this. Im not sure bet I think airplanes may have come before busses.

Oh and just to put it out there anyone can say what they want about pay or senority or whatever... Im going to become an airline pilot for two reasons. 1. Not driving a desk. 2. The view beats any 74th floor office corner window.

jungle

Bus drivers don't have to get a degree, or spend 10-15yrs gaining enough experience to get a job that pays well. Some crane operators and State police make 100k a year, and as far as Boat Captains, take a look at what a MS river boat Capt makes-about 300k.
I'd rather not compare myself to a Doctor, they accidently kill about 200,000 people a year, however if they change employers they aren't expected to start again at 30k a year and can work well into their 70s.
Most of us never get a great paying job, but if you do you've worked hard for it and it won't last long. Twenty to thirty years at best, less for most. And many of us have had to repeat the exercise a few times due to the business climate. Each time starting from the bottom. It isn't easy and the guys who have hung in there deserve every dime thay make.

CruiseFL310

i am a third year first officer at a regional airline. i knew for a very long time that i wanted to be a pilot. i did what i had to do to persue this career. i thought many times along the way about going into another field but my love for flying always brought me back.

as a regional first officer i do not make a huge salary. most of my friends make more than me but they are all envious of my job. i get to go to work and fly airplanes come home and think nothing else of it. they seem to always have work on their minds and are always stressed about something. they cant just leave work at work like i can. when i upgrade to captain with the pay rates of my airline i will make as much as these same friends. if i fly for the majors one day i will probably make more than them.

i do think chrismh is correct about knowing what you are getting into. sometimes pilot focus on the glamour idea of becoming a pilot and do not look at the big picture. the big picture is clear for everyone who wants to see it. the airlines will always have their problems and pay will probably always be an issue. it is not as if pay is a secretive issue. anybody can log into this site to see what the airlines pay.

i dont think chrismh comparing pilots to bus drivers is way off either. it is a closer comparison to a pilot than pilots who compare themselves to doctors or real estate agents because those jobs dont even come close to comparing to what a pilot does. they are completely different jobs. just because someone does not compare a pilot to some high end job like a doctor does not mean they are belittling pilots.

when i first got hired by my current airline i was thrilled. i walked through the terminals feeling like i was someone cool. trust me people dont look at pilots in a higher light than anybody else. i used to live the glamour thing and see if people looked at me when i walked by them in the terminal in my uniform. most of the time they are more concerned with getting to their next flight than to care about you or what you do. ive been mistaken as a bus driver in fact when standing outside in front of the terminal. i do think sometimes we as pilots like to think we have a glamerous job and that we deserve so much. i think it is just a job like anybody who goes to work everyday. you either like your job or you dont. i like mine and i wouldnt want to do anything else despite the cons that can come with being an airline pilot.

-CruiseFL310

preludespeeder

wow cruise, that was an excellent post. i am new to this industry and the people i have talked to say exactly what you said. Some people on this forum like to sell pilots as some special job that needs high pay but when you get down to it, it is a job that only a few percent of the population can enjoy. It is not the pay or the glamour that brings us die hard young pilots to the job, but the joy of flying and the fact that we will enjoy this job more then any job we could choose.

SkyHigh

Speeder,

Hey man if I recall you have a wife and kids. am I right? Unless you are financially independent they require a certain amount of funds to get by. I wouldn't sell yourself out too much if I were you. Once or twice a month I get a job offer to fly something. The latest offer would put me in a caravan for 2500/month. The job would be a blast and 10 years ago I would have jumped on it with both feet but I just can't take the job with a family that requires 60k to stay at a middle class life style. You cant afford to have this "I am in it for the LOVE of aviation" thing either. You need to hunt for a job that pays well. You might love aviation but that doesn't mean that it will love you back.

SkyHigh

fireman0174

There's the statement of the day.

Zaurus

If you think management is playing hard ball now, they still have another card up their sleeve. Agmonst all the requiremets to obtain your ATP for hiring, there is NO REQUIREMENT for a college degree by the FAA. Many companies require it but they know it's not a FAA requirement. Not requiring the degree for hiring would triple the flood gates tomorrow. Don't think management won't go down that road if they think that will keep down employee cost.

Imagine high school grads in the FO seat in the majors. Would they want to get paid? If so, how much do you think they will work for? I assume there would be at least one H.S. grad bus driver that would give the MAJORS a try and take an initial pay cut!!!

My profession is Real Estate and you're paid on what you negotiate, nothing more. Get as much as you can, whenever you can. And, if you get that capitalist bug to strike out on your own from management, the rewards can be tremendous.

Kill Bill

what's wrong with high school grads flying in the left seat? personally, some of the dumbest people i've ever seen were "highly educated".

disclaimer: i have a bachelors in business. it did me no damn good at all.

LAfrequentflyer

I have a BS - only got it because the military likes a four year degree for commissioning officers. My associats in electronics and CCNA are worth more outside the military than my BS...The experience of being an officer is good but it doesn't compare to he technical skills i learned as an enlisted Airman.

-LA

hfbpilot

I thought about this discussion while driving home from flying the last leg of the week this morning. Airbus A300 304,400 lbs landing 18L, wind 230@19 gusting to 38, windshear, previous aircraft went around for windshear. Captain flying leg did outstanding job putting the A/C on the runway. Until you have to sign for the jet and to fly the aircraft to the A/C manual & FAR dispatch limitations ie max x-wind, wx, low vis etc you cannot fathom the responsibility. Anyone who thinks that no special skills are required or any one can handle a wide body jet in situations such as above is naive or has never been there. Funny all the general aviation guys at my local airport were not flying today, as said above windy but clear. If it’s so easy why were they not flying? Chrish acts like every doctor is a brain surgeon, most routine doctor visits are handled by the nurse and then the doctor visits for 5 min at the end. Does that mean the doctor should be paid less? No, he gets paid for what he knows and for the occasions that require his skills, just like an airline pilot when things get bad. I do love both general aviation and my job and yes I make good money. Do I deserve a raise when my company posts back to back record profits? Yes, if nothing else as to keep up with inflation. Chrish please provide some kind of proof to the working only 10days a month. I looked at all of our bid packs and could not find any lines that only worked 10 days a month.