Carl Spackler

Wow. 5,000 posts. This thread will never go anywhere.

Carl

scambo1

The last four posts are very telling.

PG;

You are tilting at windmills focusing on Carl, you are becoming the minority view.

Holy crap, in the time it took me to type this there were like 7 posts.

DAL 88 Driver

I think it's going to take a massive change in our representation to ignite this pilot group and get people excited and engaged again. I think a big part of the apathy is simply because DALPA has no compelling objective. I mean, what's the point? DALPA's going to do what DALPA's going to do. Many of our pilots have just given up in frustration because they do not think DALPA can be changed/fixed. Obviously, I don't agree with anyone giving up... but I can certainly understand why they feel the way they do after we've gone for half a decade without DALPA advocating that we should restore what we've lost and even in some ways arguing against restoration.

You have to set the objective first. Especially with something like what we've all experienced losing half the value of our careers! You set the objective... and then you set out with a laser like focus on achieving the objective, and you develop the plan with all the details around that. Adjustments have to be made from time to time... but everything revolves around the objective. DALPA has done absolutely nothing like this. And they've had almost HALF A DECADE to do it! At this point, I'm ready to give someone else a chance. If you're a football coach, how long you gonna leave the same players in the game when they haven't moved your team downfield all game long and don't even appear to be trying to do so?


We have a lot of talent and knowledge in this pilot group. I have no doubt we have a "depth of knowledge" on the "broader issues." And a $30 million budget could afford plenty of outside expertise when needed too. Again, I see this as a diversionary argument.

Carl Spackler

Where in Doug Masters' post did he indicate anything about emotions or feelings? I realize it's key to your arguments to portray anyone considering the DPA as one overcome by emotion and unable to think rationally because of their emotions. But it really just shows how panic stricken you are. Your panic attacks keep you from responding in other than a laughable manner. Breath into a paper bag and think calm thoughts. Don't panic....don't paannniiccc...

Carl

NuGuy

Heyas,

There've been a couple of major DALPA mis-steps:

1) The scope setttlement (top down, one man show. NO LEC INVOLVEMENT ON THIS)
2) The MOU 7 debacle (The MEC did NOT want to hear they were wrong about this issue)
3) The fNWA Grievance Issue (let it be heard, and it will go away..what is there to hide?)
4) The apparent Delta Private Jets scope issue (heard nothing)
5) The Republic single carrier issue (heard nothing)
6) Failure to produce Flight Pay Loss documents to a LEC chairman, after HE was directed to do so by the membership (you're kidding, right?)
7) Removal of several trusted fNWA committee members from their positions, including KW and RA. These guys had served the NWA guys fathfully for year and had their complete trust. To push them out, really set the suspicion blender on "frappe".

Did I forget anything? After the recent LEC elections, the MEC is on a cusp. The pilot group is getting agitated, and it will only take one or two recalls to get the ball rolling in the right direction.

To let these items fester only serves to put that blender on "puree'".

Nu

DAL 88 Driver

Several resolutions passed by local councils and then marked as "received" by the MEC and essentially ignored.

NuGuy

Yup.

Nu

Carl Spackler

Classic case of whistling past the graveyard. These 2,300 cards are not just cards, they ARE votes. I'm sure there will be some that may ultimately decide not to vote, but there will be just as many pilots to vote for the new union even though they didn't sign a card. These cards thus far are not based on emotion, but your explanations are.

Agreed. But you ALPA supporters need to do the same and give the DPA a fair look. One based on logic, not a misguided love affair with a union that has already moved on from you.

Emotional arguments don't feel good. No pilot I know has any patience for emotional based discussions.

You're in love acl. There's no way you can see past it...no matter what your fellow pilots tell you to sell the idea of a pilot union run by Delta pilots for the betterment of only Delta pilots. You're asking too much of anyone to try to sell a man away from love.

Precisely correct. So the question is: Why is DALPA just realizing this now...but still doing nothing about it? Why did it take a DPA to do what they should have been doing all along? And why is over half of their questions asked during Wilson polling about the DPA?

Yeah, whatever that level is....eh acl?

As you've already established, DPA will not get any support if they only sell emotions. 2,300 cards is proof that they are selling logic and clear evidence.

Carl

Carl Spackler

Actually, ALPA discredits the facts by using the exact same language you just did. All my LEC reps and the MEC chairman have used the phrase: "perceived conflict of interest" when I've spoken to them on the subject.

Truth is that ALPA's conflicted structure is the very definition of a conflict of interest. If this was an attorney/client relationship, agent/athlete relationship, or judge/advocate relationship it would be either illegal or prohibited under ethical standards.

Many have been polled, but the majority of the questions are about the DPA. That's why DALPA doesn't have a position yet.

Carl

NuGuy

Heyas,

Personally, I think the DPA would be better served to marshall their members to change the exisiting infrastructure.

Nu