Piedmont guys/gals, AAG is backed up into a corner and getting more desperate for every month that goes by. Time is on your side. Be patient. After you vote this TA down, they will come back with a better deal. Don't make the same mistake as "others". Everyone else have said NO to a better deal than what you're being offered. Don't give it up that easy. Your pilot group are smarter than that. You have more leverage than what you think with 10,000+ pilots supporting you. Stand strong, stand united and you will see victory.

 

Look at the big picture pal. Don't let them fool you with this offer. They will come back and offer something better. Don't give it up that easy. I agree with Tom1101. He gets it

 

Why do envoys offers keep getting worse?

 

When do you guys vote on this TA?

 

They're not, however, management is hoping to get you guys to vote yes to give them more leverage, and put pressure on Envoy! This is simple management 101, they got one domino to fall(PSA), and now they're going back and forth between the remaining wholly owned operators to see who they can get to give them concessions next.

 

Technically they haven't until this last one. The B scale offer was followed by the first round of the most recent negotiation. After our MEC voted that down they came back with what became the AIP which was better than both the B scale and the first offer (we should have taken this deal but we have guys like buddies8). After we turned that down they sent 20 aircraft to compass so they only offered us a fleet guarantee of 150 aircraft (170-20) in the last deal.

If AAG comes back, and that's a big IF, they'll only be offering us whatever is left of the aircraft orders.

 

Mesa caps at 8 for FOs ($3 less at 8 years than our 4 year proposed)

Compass caps at 8 (slightly higher at 8 years vs our 4)

Air Wisconsin caps at 8 (slightly higher at 8 than our 4)

With yearly scheduled increases to the capped rates, we are right in the ballpark. There will be grandfathering as well for those above 12 and 4 years.

You can make anything sound bad if you want to. I can make 0.95 per passenger seat per hour on a Dash-100 at year 4. Is it a concession to take an A330 FO position that only pays 0.45 per passenger seat per hour at year 4? They are surely "bringing down their profession" and should demand $275 an hour as FOs, right? Don't hate on us, you have no basis. We are working within an industry framework and a lot of noise is being made about $500-$1000 a year differences over 2 or 3 years. Save it for when you get to mainline, where you take a "concession" in year 1 and sometimes year 2 on small equipment (E190) compared to even capped regional captain rates.

 

Most of what you say is true and makes sense. Saying you'll fight the pay battle when you get to mainline is a bit short sighted though. By accepting poor contracts at regionals we make it more difficult for the mainlines to negotiate pay, qol, and scope. Keep in mind I voted yes to our AIP, but you do need to think of all consequences to potential decisions before you make them.

I still think you guys should vote yes, it increases your career prospects. However, you may have to fight this decision later on in your career.

 

Why would any pilot try to argue for concessions? Are you actually management, or trying to get into management??
I'm not "trying to make anything sound bad", concessions ARE bad.
The entire regional industry has been slowly sliding backward in pay and benefits for years, either with actual concessions or pay and benefits that haven't come close to keeping up with inflation. We finally have had Expressjet, Envoy, Republic, and Silver saying NO to anymore concessions. Why does anyone feel the need to give their parent company that's been making record profits of over $1,500,000.00 dollars a quarter any concessions??? I don't get it!

 

They haven't. They've been the same or better.
You do what you think is best for you. You clearly don't see the big picture. The rest of us, including mainline pilots, wants the flying back at mainline. The sooner that happens the sooner you'll be there. The whole industry is watching closely on what decision you guys/gals make. Best of luck