Worsening Pilot Shortage
02-24-2016 | 12:34 PM
#301
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 857
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they're BLEEPING RJ FO's.. what is there to discuss??? There are Jet Blue A320 CA's with apps at DAL I know personally with degrees and no failed checks, that haven't even been called.. with internals to boot! I know a 747 air force O5 who is still waiting for a call and has 3 internals at DL. Yet the last class had 2 female FOs with NO PIC time outside of being CFI's.. what is there to discuss?
02-24-2016 | 12:37 PM
#302
just past ETP
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 517
Likes: 0
From: Cruise Captain
Unless you're doing the hiring for the company, you have no idea what qualifications they're looking for. You version of "qualified" could be completely different than theirs. Maybe they don't care who's flying the bigger airplane, or who's been flying longer, like you seem to. Do you at least understand that concept?
Maybe one day I'll run into you on a layover and we can discuss this in person as you don't want to talk over the phone and allow me to give you specifics not fit to post.
02-24-2016 | 12:44 PM
#303
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 857
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Sweetholyjesus... I feel like we're in a hold with no EFC.. You and I are going in circles.. you talk about qualifications like an HR person, not a pilot, sorry. We're not talking about people not being hired AFTER interview.. we're talking about people not getting an interview in front of much less experienced pilots (this really isn't that subjective).
Maybe one day I'll run into you on a layover and we can discuss this in person as you don't want to talk over the phone and allow me to give you specifics not fit to post.
Maybe one day I'll run into you on a layover and we can discuss this in person as you don't want to talk over the phone and allow me to give you specifics not fit to post.
02-24-2016 | 12:55 PM
#304
just past ETP
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 517
Likes: 0
From: Cruise Captain
And I'm trying to get you to look at hiring from HR's perspective, as well as a pilot's perspective. If you can't see both sides of the coin, you're missing half the story. The greatest pilot in the world could also be the biggest jerk. The nicest person in the world could also be the worst pilot. HR and pilots work together (in today's world) to find at the very least a happy medium. If you can't understand that then you must have little regard for things like CRM, employee reliability, customer service......
02-24-2016 | 01:01 PM
#306
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 857
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Ok, what part of these people ARE NOT being called for interview did you miss from my last several posts? Their attitude, reliability, and customer service skills haven't even been assessed. I've looked at the DL app... there isn't much on it other than objective experience, certificates, education, type ratings, etc.. The stuff you talk about is discovered at the interview... problem is I know a few like the two I mentioned above that haven't gotten interviews, and yet they had RJ FO's in class recently... I personally don't give a rats butt about the HR vs no HR involvement debate at this point, I'm talking about GETTING THE CALL for a shot to show your CRM, service skills, and of course your airmanship..
Once again, unless you can tell me you have the backgrounds, credentials, volunteering records, service records, and recommendations obtained by all the pilots applying or getting hired (or not getting hired) at the majors/legacies, then you can't possibly know what you're talking about.
02-24-2016 | 01:04 PM
#307
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Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 857
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I don't disagree. That's actually my point to CATIII. Pilots and HR do disagree on what qualifies as "qualified". But turning a blind eye to the difference between HR and pilots isn't useful.
02-24-2016 | 01:19 PM
#308
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 6,430
Likes: 124
From: Window seat
"But it's simple. If I'm wrong, feel free to post your evidence that less qualified minorities are being hired over more qualified white males."
"
You're ignoring the law suits that changed hiring practices post the 1980's.
"
You're ignoring the law suits that changed hiring practices post the 1980's.
02-24-2016 | 01:23 PM
#309
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 6,430
Likes: 124
From: Window seat
"As you trumpet your decades of superior experience, don't forget the simple fact: Flying today is not that difficult, and there are heaps of applicants out there who will have a safe career doing it."
If it's that easy why are the companies talking about the difficulty they're having with the new candidates?
If it's that easy why are perfectly good airplanes being bounced of hard objects?
I think technology, engineering, and training has gone a long way to help the safety numbers but there's still a lot of dumb, and/or dangerous stuff, that happens in the business. If it was simple everyone would be doing it.
If it's that easy why are the companies talking about the difficulty they're having with the new candidates?
If it's that easy why are perfectly good airplanes being bounced of hard objects?
I think technology, engineering, and training has gone a long way to help the safety numbers but there's still a lot of dumb, and/or dangerous stuff, that happens in the business. If it was simple everyone would be doing it.
02-24-2016 | 01:34 PM
#310
just past ETP
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 517
Likes: 0
From: Cruise Captain
"As you trumpet your decades of superior experience, don't forget the simple fact: Flying today is not that difficult, and there are heaps of applicants out there who will have a safe career doing it."
If it's that easy why are the companies talking about the difficulty they're having with the new candidates?
If it's that easy why are perfectly good airplanes being bounced of hard objects?
I think technology, engineering, and training has gone a long way to help the safety numbers but there's still a lot of dumb, and/or dangerous stuff, that happens in the business. If it was simple everyone would be doing it.
If it's that easy why are the companies talking about the difficulty they're having with the new candidates?
If it's that easy why are perfectly good airplanes being bounced of hard objects?
I think technology, engineering, and training has gone a long way to help the safety numbers but there's still a lot of dumb, and/or dangerous stuff, that happens in the business. If it was simple everyone would be doing it.
Yes it's still dangerous and a serious job, but it's been dumbed down an order of magnitude from what it was only 30 years ago when I was working thru my ratings.. anyone remember NDBs? HSI/ RMI's as your primary NAV instrument? Clearances like "When able, direct XYZ"? Charts out in the cockpit? No GPWS and flying stepdown non-precision approaches?
It's a lot easier today, but along with that a great many pilots coming out of the pilot farms like ATP's and such are trainwrecks with multiple failed check rides (a death sentence when I came up in flying), and all of them getting hired at the "Regionals" if they can fog a mirror..
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