UNtil the 90's there were no "regional" jets. Everything was commuter turboprop feeder airline--which paid crap. BUT, you did eventually move into a good paying airline job after 5 years or so. Regional jets popped up and mainline wanted to buy them and have mainline pilots fly them on a B scale. Mainline pilots said no way. Mainline mgmt., then negotiated scope relief to create alter ego airlines flying the "small" 50 seat regional jets over 5-700 mile distances. A few years later, after 9/11 bankruptcies, these "regional" jets are flying transcons on mainline routes and mainline pilots are ceding more and more scope.

The COMAIR strike of early 2001 CRIPPLED Delta and forced them to increase pay. After that, EVERY mainline was hellbent to outsource flying to multiple regionals to diversify risk. But they got greedy and went overboard. Post 9/11 meant pilots were cheap and plentiful, there were no flight time regulations, other than commericial mins of 250 hrs. So "airline pilot" suddenly became an entry level job. MESA and maybe some other regionals were hiring at 250 hrs in order to pay 19,000/yr.

 

That pretty much sums it up.

I just commented on the other thread where people were so impressed with the fact that it was possible for a person to get from student pilot to Delta Airlines in 12 years flat! 20-30 years ago that would have been an eternity. Back then "regionals" really were regional airlines and employed about 15% of the pilot workforce who could reasonably expect to move on within a few years (5 years when things were slow). You would go from left seat of a 19 seat turboprop to right seat of a Boeing...a logical transition.

These days most pilots work at "regionals" flying full sized jet aircraft. It's become a game of musical chairs and they keep pulling away more chairs.

A lot of pilots just refuse to play the game anymore and have walked away so they scream "pilot shortage" and claim to need more new pilots instead of trying to attract or keep experienced pilots that are already out there.

The lure of one day getting to one of those chairs when the music stops still seems to work though.

My argument is that all this wasn't caused by the unions, it was enabled by the unions and the seniority system which has become a leveraging tool of big airline management, without which the modern "regional airline" payscale model would not be possible. If pilots were able to leverage their experience to compete on an even playing field they wouldn't be married to their job and could jump ship anytime their airline tried to push more crap on them.

As far as "greybeards" go...yes...I have one (day off)

 

If there were a shortage of accountants then companies that require the services of accountants would pay more and/or do something to make the career appear more attractive.

Regional carriers caused the problem of poor wages, work rules, and have lowered the career expectations and long term earning potential of pilots, therefore, screw the regional managements. They cry about no pilots, so what....

It is supply and demand, and as we are reminded on occasion, the best piece of safety equipment an airline or an airliner can have is a well trained and experienced pilot.

My main concern long term is that majors won't have access to well trained and experienced pilots. What we don't want to see is major airline pilots learning the business with somewhere around 2000 hours and 1500 of that in GA aircraft.

 

True, but mainline management is just as culpable in causing the pilot shortage.

Mainline has demanded cheaper and cheaper feed from the regional airlines, and in so doing, they have caused regional management to continually tighten the screws on pilot pay.

The mainlines could have easily said "You know what? We need to do our part to ensure that the supply of new pilots continues unabated, especially given our upcoming onslaught of retirements, so we will dictate that our regional airline partners pay their pilots a wage that will entice young would-be aviators to invest in themselves and pursue a career as a professional pilot".

But no. Today's mainline management, (like most of corporate America's MBA-studded management ranks), cannot see past their next bonus period. They couldn't give two shiits about the viability of their airline in 5 years, because in 5 years they will have collected their bonuses, burnished their résumés, and moved on to ruin another corporate entity. These rats will always be the first ones to abandon their sinking ship.

 

Actually the correct way to describe it would be "Regional carriers created the problem..."

After all they knew what they were doing and their goal was to lower the cost of labor. Majors contributed to the creation by encouraging the outsourcing of labor. Unions facilitated the creation by providing the essential tools and ingredients that make the regional airline model possible. If you take away one of those three things the regional airline model would cease to exist.

 

Well, there is a shortage of nurses. So they raised wages some and began handing out visas like parking lot pamphlets in order to increase the supply. Can't do that with pilots, so they have to try and lower the qualifications. Once again, ALPA, WTH are you? ALPA needs to push back with this simple tactic, what would you think if the qualifications for doctor, nurse, lawyer were lowered? Would that be just as good?

 

Here's a little perspective from a former furloughed mainline DL pilot;

The Comair strike "crippled" Delta only because...MAINLINE DELTA PILOTS refused to fly CMR struck work..even though you were flying DELTA passengers. I know..I flew a 727 thru CVG several times a week throughout the strike and we checked our "struck work guide" on every turn. We could have EASILY covered every COMAIR city pair and moved DELTA passengers through the system. HAD WE NOT SUPPORTED COMAIR PILOTS, the strike would have been CRUSHED.

Instead, we wrote strike assessment checks and did everything we could do to support COMAIR pilots close the pay gap and make them the highest paid RJ drivers in the industry. Then 9/11, and furloughed DL pilots were replaced by those very same COMAIR pilots. Did those COMAIR pilots refuse to fly those "transcons" until all mainline furloughees were recalled? No..instead, the COMAIR MEC refused to let furloughed DELTA pilots sit in the RIGHT seat to raise the gear for the "graybeards" in return for preferred hiring at DELTA.

Had the COMAIR MEC done the right thing..this whole scope, RJ pay, whipsawing FFD race to the bottom could have been shut down in 2001. Every former COMAIR PILOT would have had a stack of rec letters from DL MAINLINE PILOTS and all of us would be flying across the pond buying beers for former COMAIR pilots.

Instead..we got the RJDC and years of scope relaxation during post 9/11 BK contract concessions that, believe me..no mainline pilot wanted. Yeah, yeah..we "sold scope for pay".. Fine, but RJ guys sure didn't pay for it and certainly benefitted from it for the last 15 years.

 

Advocates Say New Pilot Rules May Face Challenges - AVweb flash Article

 

So true. Continental used to guarantee XJT a 10% profit under CEO Bethune. He understood the whole cheese pizza thing. XJT was run to mainline stds. Clean, catered, consistently 99% completion factor, high morale, AND one of the best contracts out there. Maint. was top notch too. Then along came Larry... It is greed, selfish "managing", and complete refusal to plan ahead. That is the reason for the "shortage".

 

And this is why you will fail.

Upgrades should be based on applying and being selected, like in pretty much every other normal business. No seniority outside of equipment and position. Captain from airline A should be able to apply for captain of airline B. If you get hired into position X at an airline, that's your position until you apply and go somewhere else or apply for a higher position. Some may not get hired due to cost-to-benefit, but some would and be a better benefit to the company. This would force wages to a competitive "free market" scale, like most other professions. The "entitlement generation" started with seniority as far as pilots go IMO.