Malaysian 777 missing
03-15-2014 | 10:12 AM
#352
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2010
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From: Phoenix
This is what I suspect. Fire in the E & E bay (or whatever they call the main electronics bay on a 777). I believe in the 747-400 and 777, this bay is in front of the forward cargo bay, and under or just aft of the cockpit. Maybe fire caused by adjacent hazardous cargo in the cargo hold, if it was near the E&E bay? (UPS 6) Causes a loss of major electrical busses. Happened to Swissair 111; UPS 6.
While dealing with loss of electronics, crew starts a turn for an emergency return to Kuala Lampur. Midway through the turn, overcome by toxic fumes, controls released.
The 777 is a fly-by-wire airplane. Now unguided, it will fly at at a trimmed airspeed, I think (can't remember. The A-320 flies at 1-g, but I think Boeing went with airspeed...been too long since 777 school, and I never flew the airplane...got bumped post 9-11).
If it is airspeed-trimmed, it will climb and descend in a phugoid (sort-of) until it runs out of fuel, or hits something.
I don't see how the Malaysian officials or news media are jumping on the statement "the transponder and ACARS were deliberately turned off..." To say so with certainty would require a "Being turned OFF signal," not just a sudden or progressive loss of signal.
For the "deliberate pilot action" crowd, I would say a guy with 18,000 hours and 33 years at the company isn't a likely suspect. A 27 year old who likes to invite good looking women in the cockpit isn't a likely suspect either.
While dealing with loss of electronics, crew starts a turn for an emergency return to Kuala Lampur. Midway through the turn, overcome by toxic fumes, controls released.
The 777 is a fly-by-wire airplane. Now unguided, it will fly at at a trimmed airspeed, I think (can't remember. The A-320 flies at 1-g, but I think Boeing went with airspeed...been too long since 777 school, and I never flew the airplane...got bumped post 9-11).
If it is airspeed-trimmed, it will climb and descend in a phugoid (sort-of) until it runs out of fuel, or hits something.
I don't see how the Malaysian officials or news media are jumping on the statement "the transponder and ACARS were deliberately turned off..." To say so with certainty would require a "Being turned OFF signal," not just a sudden or progressive loss of signal.
For the "deliberate pilot action" crowd, I would say a guy with 18,000 hours and 33 years at the company isn't a likely suspect. A 27 year old who likes to invite good looking women in the cockpit isn't a likely suspect either.
03-15-2014 | 11:16 AM
#353
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Joined: Mar 2008
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From: Curator at Static Display
Listen, this is was sounds plausible. Until you hear the aircraft is flying to waypoints, and for hours and hours. Maybe a fire took out the ACARS, transponder, etc., but the climbs and descents, and point to point flying after the fact are key points here. I am waiting for more facts here, too much political influence going on, and the whole story is not being told. Gets weirder and weirder.
If I recall correctly, the A-320 had seven Flight-Control computers; four primary, and three that did some auxiliary function, and they are all located in the cockpit. I am making an assumption the 777 is similar, and if the E&E fire scenario is plausible, it would also support the premise the aircraft could continue to fly thereafter.
03-15-2014 | 11:32 AM
#354
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined: Jan 2006
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From: Engines Turn or People Swim
I hadn't heard about the known-waypoints (and if that is true, how close did they get? Just "near," or dead-on? And if dead-on, where is the tracking information that proved it? That would suggest they knew where it was). There are lots of known-waypoints in the world, so just flying randomly, one could argue it appeared it was deliberate navigation.
If I recall correctly, the A-320 had seven Flight-Control computers; four primary, and three that did some auxiliary function, and they are all located in the cockpit. I am making an assumption the 777 is similar, and if the E&E fire scenario is plausible, it would also support the premise the aircraft could continue to fly thereafter.
If I recall correctly, the A-320 had seven Flight-Control computers; four primary, and three that did some auxiliary function, and they are all located in the cockpit. I am making an assumption the 777 is similar, and if the E&E fire scenario is plausible, it would also support the premise the aircraft could continue to fly thereafter.
03-15-2014 | 11:35 AM
#355
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2014
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Given the estimated weight of the aircraft at the time it was reported to have climbed to 45,000 feet - could the aircraft even physically have done so?
And unless a Mach hold was engaged could the aircraft credibly descend to 20-something thousand feet quickly without exceeding Mach limitations?
And unless a Mach hold was engaged could the aircraft credibly descend to 20-something thousand feet quickly without exceeding Mach limitations?
03-15-2014 | 12:39 PM
#357
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2005
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From: EMB120 CA
Anyone know how long the CVR records in the 777? I think most planes are 2 hours, and if that's the case, the CVR will likely not contain the initial moments of what happened, if it is ever recovered. Or they may have pulled the breaker on it as well.
03-15-2014 | 12:44 PM
#359
Why did l start.....???
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 123
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From: F/O
see here
http://airinfo.org/2014/03/14/dispar...locean-indien/
I think that shows the plane still under control of someone...........
pprune .org
http://airinfo.org/2014/03/14/dispar...locean-indien/
I think that shows the plane still under control of someone...........
pprune .org
03-15-2014 | 12:48 PM
#360
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Joined: Feb 2007
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What do you mean by 'signed off'? And is that 100% confirmed fact? Is there not any non-malicious reason why someone would do that?
The only thing we, the public, know for certain is that the airplane didn't arrive at its intended destination and that we don't know where it is now. There are no other hard 100% established facts known about this mystery.
Right now the evidence leaves the door open for numerous plausible scenarios and far too many people and news outlets are fitting the evidence into pre-conceived conclusions instead of waiting to draw their conclusions after finding more hard factual evidence.
The only thing we, the public, know for certain is that the airplane didn't arrive at its intended destination and that we don't know where it is now. There are no other hard 100% established facts known about this mystery.
Right now the evidence leaves the door open for numerous plausible scenarios and far too many people and news outlets are fitting the evidence into pre-conceived conclusions instead of waiting to draw their conclusions after finding more hard factual evidence.
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