K4 Pilots Declaration Of Independance !
01-18-2018, 05:05 PM
#511
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2012
Position: B777 CA
Posts: 585
Originally Posted by Globemaster2827
I'm not a UPS FO but there's no way I'd vote for that baring a $450 an hour pay rate. I'm sure it's somehow Dan Wells's fault that yall voted for an Industry Worst Retirement. This isn't a troll but please spare us the "We Raised the Bar" nonsense with that retirement plan.
Go look at what Spirit just got. It starts at year 1 as an 11% direct contribution and goes up 1% a year until year 5 where it's 15%. So day 1 they'll get 2.2 times what you get going to 3 times by year 5 and that's just the first 10-11 months of the year. After that you have no retirement. That's the type of improvement that we should be striving for...
The duty day was just a small detail to me. The fact that I'll be funding most of my own retirement would be the big deal to me.
Go look at what Spirit just got. It starts at year 1 as an 11% direct contribution and goes up 1% a year until year 5 where it's 15%. So day 1 they'll get 2.2 times what you get going to 3 times by year 5 and that's just the first 10-11 months of the year. After that you have no retirement. That's the type of improvement that we should be striving for...
The duty day was just a small detail to me. The fact that I'll be funding most of my own retirement would be the big deal to me.
I'll repeat something I said a few months ago
do you think that you - your negotiators - your exco - or Dan Wells is going to get you everything that you want in your next contract?
we didn't get everything that we wanted in our contract - but we got a lot
01-18-2018, 05:43 PM
#512
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,236
Originally Posted by Lockheed
I knew you were not a ups fo --that was a dig
I'll repeat something I said a few months ago
do you think that you - your negotiators - your exco - or Dan Wells is going to get you everything that you want in your next contract?
we didn't get everything that we wanted in our contract - but we got a lot
I'll repeat something I said a few months ago
do you think that you - your negotiators - your exco - or Dan Wells is going to get you everything that you want in your next contract?
we didn't get everything that we wanted in our contract - but we got a lot
Just a point that yall did vote on it and voted for that retirement. That retirement would be a complete deal breaker for me, but I do know that pilots love to vote for rates. Would Atlas vote for that if we were offered your rates +$5 an hour and current book? Maybe. I know I'd be a no vote and moving to another airline even if I were a 12 year Captain. My hope would be that if our current book retirement were presented to us for a vote that we'd vote it down 95%+.
When our new contract does come there will be plenty of things we're irritated about and we agree 100% on that.
01-18-2018, 05:58 PM
#513
VHR-very happily retired
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: Retired
Posts: 1,409
Originally Posted by Globemaster2827
"Raising the bar".... Tell me more about K4's retirement program that more than 80% of K4 voted for. My understanding is that if you crack $200,000 (a mark a 2nd year UPS FO cracks) that K4 no longer matches to your retirement. Your current retirement would be worse than Atlas's Amalgamated retirement concocted in 2011.
If my reading of that is correct that's the worst retirement that I know of and K4 voted to keep that in place for a minimum of 5 years. If true K4's Captains get no retirement the last few months of the year.
If my reading of that is correct that's the worst retirement that I know of and K4 voted to keep that in place for a minimum of 5 years. If true K4's Captains get no retirement the last few months of the year.
How would you ever enforce or even evaluate wheather a particular pilot group was raising the bar? That would mean that EVERY section of the contract would have to be better than every other pilot groups present contract. Pretty impossible task
01-18-2018, 06:04 PM
#514
VHR-very happily retired
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: Retired
Posts: 1,409
Originally Posted by Globemaster2827
If true K4's Captains get no retirement the last few months of the year.
01-18-2018, 06:14 PM
#515
VHR-very happily retired
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: Retired
Posts: 1,409
Originally Posted by Globemaster2827
I'm not a UPS FO but there's no way I'd vote for that baring a $450 an hour pay rate. I'm sure it's somehow Dan Wells's fault that yall voted for an Industry Worst Retirement. This isn't a troll but please spare us the "We Raised the Bar" nonsense with that retirement plan.
Go look at what Spirit just got. It starts at year 1 as an 11% direct contribution and goes up 1% a year until year 5 where it's 15%. So day 1 they'll get 2.2 times what you get going to 3 times by year 5 and that's just the first 10-11 months of the year. After that you have no retirement. That's the type of improvement that we should be striving for...
The duty day was just a small detail to me. The fact that I'll be funding most of my own retirement would be the big deal to me.
Go look at what Spirit just got. It starts at year 1 as an 11% direct contribution and goes up 1% a year until year 5 where it's 15%. So day 1 they'll get 2.2 times what you get going to 3 times by year 5 and that's just the first 10-11 months of the year. After that you have no retirement. That's the type of improvement that we should be striving for...
The duty day was just a small detail to me. The fact that I'll be funding most of my own retirement would be the big deal to me.
01-18-2018, 06:30 PM
#516
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,236
Originally Posted by maxjet
This might be true at Atlas if you had our retirement plan. However, it is even worse than you wrote. You see at our pay and work rules we have FO’s that hit 200K. Most of our Captains are there way earlier than that. Heck, we have Captains who work a lot and probably pay in taxes what you make at Atlas.
01-18-2018, 06:33 PM
#517
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,236
Originally Posted by maxjet
We will be so happy for you when you settle for nothing but the best contract in the Airline industry. I hear minimum UPS + 15%? Good luck up there in your perfect little world. I hear it is such a joy working over at Atlas. Lots of adventure. Landing at the wrong airport, missing an Asian mountain top by 100 feet, gosh, it must be so exciting to work over there with such professional and intelligent pilots. Your posts represent the level of intelligence and professionalism that I hear about in your pilot group. I am in awe. Please consider me and let me join you as a student. My life would be so fulfilling and all of my worldly questions would be answered. I can think of nothing better than to be allowed to sit at the feet of someone as god like as you
01-18-2018, 07:13 PM
#518
Banned
Joined APC: Feb 2017
Posts: 2,275
Originally Posted by Globemaster2827
Working at Atlas does stink as it does at any ACMI. Most of us will be taking the first job out of it as soon as we can. Last year we sent around 215 to those destination airlines that we aspire to be one day. This year that number will grow.
01-18-2018, 07:45 PM
#519
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,236
Originally Posted by No Land 3
I feel empathy for you, this entire industry is crap luck. K4 is my only ACMI experience, and I can safely say that 95% of the pilots I fly with post contract are happy to be here, and most don’t want to go anywhere else.
01-18-2018, 09:11 PM
#520
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2016
Posts: 30
Globemaster2827
When you said "look at what the Spirit pilots just got for retirement" it's funny how you forgot to mention this what ALPA JUST GOT FOR THE SPIRIT PILOTS! I am sure this was just a small oversight by you. Also it is exactly why K4 pilots will soon be moving to ALPA from 1224, as the Spirit pilots had ZERO influence from other ALPA airlines and negotiated for exactly what was important for THEM!
When you said "look at what the Spirit pilots just got for retirement" it's funny how you forgot to mention this what ALPA JUST GOT FOR THE SPIRIT PILOTS! I am sure this was just a small oversight by you. Also it is exactly why K4 pilots will soon be moving to ALPA from 1224, as the Spirit pilots had ZERO influence from other ALPA airlines and negotiated for exactly what was important for THEM!
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