FDX - APR Disputed Pairings
04-04-2008 | 11:45 AM
#121
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 732
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Guys,
My fault and I apologize to BC, but I find it absolutely ridiculous that the CDG-STN-MEM is disputed some months but not others. Can you have it BOTH ways???????? If so, you can fire away at me all night long, but the SIG is wrong about this.
Don't bother explaining the process to me, as I know why they do it. But it is plain and simple stupid to say it's OK one month yet be called a non-member next. Maybe non member Bob is right after all.
F'in stupid.
My fault and I apologize to BC, but I find it absolutely ridiculous that the CDG-STN-MEM is disputed some months but not others. Can you have it BOTH ways???????? If so, you can fire away at me all night long, but the SIG is wrong about this.
Don't bother explaining the process to me, as I know why they do it. But it is plain and simple stupid to say it's OK one month yet be called a non-member next. Maybe non member Bob is right after all.
F'in stupid.
#4, 11, 48, 103, 108, 118, 124, 126, 186, 239, 273, 279, 337, 475, 482, 672, 673, 2003, 2007, 2009, 2015, 2016, 2018, 2023, 2025, 2027, 2054, and 2073 (2-leg sequence of CDG-MAN-MEM in the same duty period or a 2-leg sequence of CDG-STN-MEM in the same duty period) In September 2007, the sequence of CDG-MAN-MEM was disputed and the disputable issues have not been addressed. The CDG-STN-MEM sequence, while not disputable previously, is now being disputed based upon new times which put the scheduled duty period very close to the 13:30 limit. Based on operational history the STN-MEM has to date blocked in late in 43% of the time it’s flown.
04-04-2008 | 11:51 AM
#122
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2006
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Different issue now: It is a duty issue, when a pairing consistently breaks scheduled duty limits, it is also a valid reason for dispute and being fixed.
#4, 11, 48, 103, 108, 118, 124, 126, 186, 239, 273, 279, 337, 475, 482, 672, 673, 2003, 2007, 2009, 2015, 2016, 2018, 2023, 2025, 2027, 2054, and 2073 (2-leg sequence of CDG-MAN-MEM in the same duty period or a 2-leg sequence of CDG-STN-MEM in the same duty period) In September 2007, the sequence of CDG-MAN-MEM was disputed and the disputable issues have not been addressed. The CDG-STN-MEM sequence, while not disputable previously, is now being disputed based upon new times which put the scheduled duty period very close to the 13:30 limit. Based on operational history the STN-MEM has to date blocked in late in 43% of the time it’s flown.
#4, 11, 48, 103, 108, 118, 124, 126, 186, 239, 273, 279, 337, 475, 482, 672, 673, 2003, 2007, 2009, 2015, 2016, 2018, 2023, 2025, 2027, 2054, and 2073 (2-leg sequence of CDG-MAN-MEM in the same duty period or a 2-leg sequence of CDG-STN-MEM in the same duty period) In September 2007, the sequence of CDG-MAN-MEM was disputed and the disputable issues have not been addressed. The CDG-STN-MEM sequence, while not disputable previously, is now being disputed based upon new times which put the scheduled duty period very close to the 13:30 limit. Based on operational history the STN-MEM has to date blocked in late in 43% of the time it’s flown.
As a side note, this is the same issue with CDG-MAN-MEM, if they go over 13:30 consistently, the Company needs to fix them per the CBA.
04-04-2008 | 11:56 AM
#123
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Joined: Feb 2007
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From: headbanging
Got a call back from DM, union leadership. Explained the DP process to me.. I was patient, explained to me how a letter was sent to the pilot who has the dp explaining, educating, etc... after they have flow one another letter if forwared to the pilot. The "two letters" are how the union is handleing the dp problem. I was assigned a dp on reserve.. never got a letter. I feel slighted.
I asked why the union doesn't come out and say, hey d.head... don't fly dp's. His reply was it's not the union's job to dictate how a member handles their professional career. ... yes that was the actual answer.... My question to that policy is why do we have professional standards then? Why even have a sig for that matter. It is the union's job to direct how some things are done... not politically correct or popular, but where have I heard "it's the right thing to do?" Some things the union should take a stand on and inform the membership, this is how we do it.. I'm getting the feeling that there's a PC environment that's overcome the union, and is keeping them from doing what the membership wants.
I spoke with him at lenght and made it very clear my disatisfaction with how the "big 3" were not supporting the sig by not endorseing the don't fly dp policy. He did seem surprised that it was noted there was a lack of leadership coming from the top on this issue. "good input Mike"
I like DM... he's the more realistic of the 3, but he needs to get the message on this dp issue. Lead or get out of the way!
anyway.. that's the quick post on it..
I asked why the union doesn't come out and say, hey d.head... don't fly dp's. His reply was it's not the union's job to dictate how a member handles their professional career. ... yes that was the actual answer.... My question to that policy is why do we have professional standards then? Why even have a sig for that matter. It is the union's job to direct how some things are done... not politically correct or popular, but where have I heard "it's the right thing to do?" Some things the union should take a stand on and inform the membership, this is how we do it.. I'm getting the feeling that there's a PC environment that's overcome the union, and is keeping them from doing what the membership wants.
I spoke with him at lenght and made it very clear my disatisfaction with how the "big 3" were not supporting the sig by not endorseing the don't fly dp policy. He did seem surprised that it was noted there was a lack of leadership coming from the top on this issue. "good input Mike"
I like DM... he's the more realistic of the 3, but he needs to get the message on this dp issue. Lead or get out of the way!
anyway.. that's the quick post on it..
04-04-2008 | 12:27 PM
#125
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 4,184
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From: leaning to the left
We are in negotiations
I've read a lot of biatching about the scheduling section of our CBA. Rightfully so. And, how we need to fix it in the next round of negotiations.
GUESS WHAT? WE ARE IN NEGOTIATIONS!! RIGHT NOW!!
I can't believe that everyone can't understand that we are in negotiations on scheduling, every month. The SIG IS our current negotiating team, on that issue.
If you voluntarily fly a DP, you are actively working against our negotiating team. It's that simple.
This is no different than an individual picking up extra trips, during mediation. These people are part of the problem!! And, they need to understand that.
If we can't convince them now...How are we going to convince them 2 years from now?
Maybe even more important...How are we going to convince management that it needs to be fixed?
GUESS WHAT? WE ARE IN NEGOTIATIONS!! RIGHT NOW!!
I can't believe that everyone can't understand that we are in negotiations on scheduling, every month. The SIG IS our current negotiating team, on that issue.
If you voluntarily fly a DP, you are actively working against our negotiating team. It's that simple.
This is no different than an individual picking up extra trips, during mediation. These people are part of the problem!! And, they need to understand that.
If we can't convince them now...How are we going to convince them 2 years from now?
Maybe even more important...How are we going to convince management that it needs to be fixed?
Last edited by Busboy; 04-04-2008 at 01:23 PM.
04-04-2008 | 03:43 PM
#127
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,409
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Got a call back from DM, union leadership. Explained the DP process to me.. I was patient, explained to me how a letter was sent to the pilot who has the dp explaining, educating, etc... after they have flow one another letter if forwared to the pilot. The "two letters" are how the union is handleing the dp problem. I was assigned a dp on reserve.. never got a letter. I feel slighted.
I asked why the union doesn't come out and say, hey d.head... don't fly dp's. His reply was it's not the union's job to dictate how a member handles their professional career. ... yes that was the actual answer.... My question to that policy is why do we have professional standards then? Why even have a sig for that matter. It is the union's job to direct how some things are done... not politically correct or popular, but where have I heard "it's the right thing to do?" Some things the union should take a stand on and inform the membership, this is how we do it.. I'm getting the feeling that there's a PC environment that's overcome the union, and is keeping them from doing what the membership wants.
I spoke with him at lenght and made it very clear my disatisfaction with how the "big 3" were not supporting the sig by not endorseing the don't fly dp policy. He did seem surprised that it was noted there was a lack of leadership coming from the top on this issue. "good input Mike"
I like DM... he's the more realistic of the 3, but he needs to get the message on this dp issue. Lead or get out of the way!
anyway.. that's the quick post on it..
I asked why the union doesn't come out and say, hey d.head... don't fly dp's. His reply was it's not the union's job to dictate how a member handles their professional career. ... yes that was the actual answer.... My question to that policy is why do we have professional standards then? Why even have a sig for that matter. It is the union's job to direct how some things are done... not politically correct or popular, but where have I heard "it's the right thing to do?" Some things the union should take a stand on and inform the membership, this is how we do it.. I'm getting the feeling that there's a PC environment that's overcome the union, and is keeping them from doing what the membership wants.
I spoke with him at lenght and made it very clear my disatisfaction with how the "big 3" were not supporting the sig by not endorseing the don't fly dp policy. He did seem surprised that it was noted there was a lack of leadership coming from the top on this issue. "good input Mike"
I like DM... he's the more realistic of the 3, but he needs to get the message on this dp issue. Lead or get out of the way!
anyway.. that's the quick post on it..
04-04-2008 | 05:19 PM
#128
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 712
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From: 777 Multi-tasker
Very good post. I am in complete agreement with you. Our top 3 leaders don't have the stones to support it. They leave it to the underlings to beat the dp drum. In fact they are so out of touch our EX VP (or whatever his lofty title is) for ALPA National accidently picked one up a couple months ago. What a pathetic display of leadership we have had out of DW and his band of merry men over the last two years. Good job on the contract, and then they dropped their packs and sucked up to ALPA national. Of course they won't make a stand on the dp issues, what is in it for them?
.... anyone else?
04-05-2008 | 03:16 AM
#129
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 712
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From: 777 Multi-tasker
ok, talked with one of the ANC fo's and got an e mail from the other. Seems like both requested dp's on their vto requests.... once called back the other offered to call in the e mail.
amazing. and our block rep sends out at least 2 e mails prior to the vto's and open time... gotta frustrate him, takes the time to do it and it still slips through the cracks. Good on him for trying through.
jag
amazing. and our block rep sends out at least 2 e mails prior to the vto's and open time... gotta frustrate him, takes the time to do it and it still slips through the cracks. Good on him for trying through.
jag
04-05-2008 | 07:05 AM
#130
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 184
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From: Moving Around
727 Capts
Just checked on the 727 Capts to see how we were doing....Pitiful. About half of the 25 are already assigned. Some from VTO's but sadly most are line holders swapping to sweeten or fatten their line. 
There was one individual that knocked out the entire month with vacation and then picked up a carry over DP for the first week of May.
There is a flex guy on pay-only picking up one; I guess the trip isn't so bad if it is the only trip you fly that month.
Then there is a DP hog that has 3 and is a calandar blocker to boot....Thing is he held a line and traded into the 3 of them. One to better the line but a couple to fatten the line!
I am sending each an email asking that to help their fellow pilots, they at least respond to the SIG with their detailed inputs on the Disputed Pairing they have chosen to fly!
There was one individual that knocked out the entire month with vacation and then picked up a carry over DP for the first week of May.
There is a flex guy on pay-only picking up one; I guess the trip isn't so bad if it is the only trip you fly that month.
Then there is a DP hog that has 3 and is a calandar blocker to boot....Thing is he held a line and traded into the 3 of them. One to better the line but a couple to fatten the line!
I am sending each an email asking that to help their fellow pilots, they at least respond to the SIG with their detailed inputs on the Disputed Pairing they have chosen to fly!
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