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Old 09-03-2025 | 04:13 PM
  #5511  
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Originally Posted by Gone Flying
I do, and I’ve been here long enough to understand they consider us fully staffed.

idk how much block hour growth we will see, it seems like we may see some capacity growth from upgauging, but I’m not sure we will see too many more planes.
The fleet is expected to grow in 2026 - getting a solid bump of A220’s for 26’ in fact. Of course, if the 7M10 gets and/or the A321 seats get certified logic points towards hiring going crazy.. especially for the 7M10.

A hefty 787 or top off 350/330 order expected EOY + 20 35K’s & another 20 options to be considered going into late 26’ will affect things too.
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Old 09-03-2025 | 04:19 PM
  #5512  
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Originally Posted by Ripinpeace
The fleet is expected to grow in 2026 - getting a solid bump of A220’s for 26’ in fact. Of course, if the 7M10 gets and/or the A321 seats get certified logic points towards hiring going crazy.

A hefty 787 or top off 350/330 order expected EOY + 20 35K’s & another 20 options to be considered going into late 26’ will affect things too.
My understanding is
-A35Ks are delayed until 2027, and some will replace 767s, so not all growth
-73m10 delayed UFN, still not certified, 73n pilots have not seen even started max training, which needs to be done by everyone before Entry to service
-we will get some 321Ns, those will replace some 757s and 320s as they have been.
-I was told recently the 321 lie flats will need to get a new seats as the current ones are not certifiable. I think we raided the engines from those planes due to P&W issues.
- aren’t the 220s still significantly delayed? will we get more than a dozen in 2026?
- a WB “top off” order would just be replacing the 60 or so 767s we have, moving existing pilots to a new plane and simplifying the fleet. No real growth.

seems like 500-750 new pilots would be in the ballpark.
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Old 09-03-2025 | 04:30 PM
  #5513  
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Originally Posted by Gone Flying
My understanding is
-A35Ks are delayed until 2027, and some will replace 767s, so not all growth
-73m10 delayed UFN, still not certified, 73n pilots have not seen even started max training, which needs to be done by everyone before Entry to service
-we will get some 321Ns, those will replace some 757s and 320s as they have been.
-I was told recently the 321 lie flats will need to get a new seats as the current ones are not certifiable. I think we raided the engines from those planes due to P&W issues.
- aren’t the 220s still significantly delayed? will we get more than a dozen in 2026?
- a WB “top off” order would just be replacing the 60 or so 767s we have, moving existing pilots to a new plane and simplifying the fleet. No real growth.

seems like 500-750 new pilots would be in the ballpark.
No A35K is replacing a 767. 35K’s will release 359’s for more growth. The 764’s are not retiring anytime soon.

7M10 expected to be certified in 2026. When it does, Delta has proven it can ramp up hiring instantly to meet needs. There will be a ton of growth here.

If you think they’re going to retire a 757 for every A321N that arrives then you’re correct - but they won’t. The 757’s will last into mid 2030’s.

Airbus has been able to double the production capacity of the 220. This fleet is pure growth until 717’s are parked (no time soon).

The 20 options would be pure growth - which is was the original 20 35K’s are.. pure growth. The 35K will also return DL to Singapore, India, middle-east, etc. and increasing capacity on SYD, JNB, ICN, LHR.. allowing a lot of 359’s to deployed elsewhere when those come.

A 50-60 787-10 order plus option will replace the 763’s and options for growth. This will cause massive growth in the WB paying fleet + capacity increase. Similar to how much of UA’s 787 order is majority replacement - as 2026 is the last year until United begins to retire the 767’s and older 777’s.



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Old 09-03-2025 | 04:45 PM
  #5514  
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Originally Posted by Ripinpeace
No A35K is replacing a 767. 35K’s will release 359’s for more growth. The 764’s are not retiring anytime soon.

7M10 expected to be certified in 2026. When it does, Delta has proven it can ramp up hiring instantly to meet needs. There will be a ton of growth here.

If you think they’re going to retire a 757 for every A321N that arrives then you’re correct - but they won’t. The 757’s will last into mid 2030’s.

Airbus has been able to double the production capacity of the 220. This fleet is pure growth until 717’s are parked (no time soon).

The 20 options would be pure growth - which is was the original 20 35K’s are.. pure growth. The 35K will also return DL to Singapore, India, middle-east, etc. and increasing capacity on SYD, JNB, ICN, LHR.. allowing a lot of 359’s to deployed elsewhere when those come.

A 50-60 787-10 order plus option will replace the 763’s and options for growth. This will cause massive growth in the WB paying fleet + capacity increase. Similar to how much of UA’s 787 order is majority replacement - as 2026 is the last year until United begins to retire the 767’s and older 777’s.
I think this is a wildly optimistic take. I think many things here are conjecture at best.

I have been told several times by multiple 767 sim instructors the -400 will not last much longer than the -300.

if a 350-1000 replaces a -900, which replaces a 764, which replaces a 763, which gets parked, isn’t that the same as the 35k replacing a 767.

the idea that aircraft we have not even ordered yet are already earmarked as “pure growth” is a funny concept. “We have not even decided if we will buy these, but if we do there is no way we use them to replace our 30 year old, outdated 767s”

737 pilots need specific MAX training. No line pilots have even started receiving this yet. That does not happen overnight.

I don’t know a ton about UA, but I know they are forecasting to hire 2,000 next year, that doesn’t sound like hiring for mostly replacements to me. It definitely seems like they are more growth focused than us.

I’m glad we have optimists, but I’m not seeing it. Time will tell.

Last edited by Gone Flying; 09-03-2025 at 05:02 PM.
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Old 09-03-2025 | 05:02 PM
  #5515  
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Originally Posted by planejoe
Flight Ops update states we are done with classes/hiring in 2025 and plan to only hire for attrition in 2026 (which they stated may change but that's the current plan).

Classes to resume in "first half of 2026". 2026 retirements per ALPA are 506.
FWIW, from the time we stopped classes in May 2025 to the end of 2026, there will be about 800 retirements. I submit 800 would be consistent with what was published today. Anything less than that would actually be shrinkage.

Originally Posted by Gone Flying
Did you read the same memo I did? Idk how you extrapolate 1,500 from we plan to hire for retirements and planned attrition.

We did all our hiring for 2025 in Q1, seems like that is the plan again next year.
As someone reminded me recently, though the last 'hire date" was in March, they were 9E flows that were held back, and actually completed indoc in May. So 5-ish months of hiring.

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Old 09-03-2025 | 05:05 PM
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Originally Posted by FangsF15
FWIW, from the time we stopped classes in May 2025 to the end of 2026, there will be about 800 retirements. I submit 800 would be consistent with what was published today. Anything less than that would actually be shrinkage.
we had about the same number of retirements in all of 2025 (500ish) and we just did all the hiring for this year before summer. it just depends on where we are measuring from. Are we staring with January 2025, and including the 500 we hired this year, or May 2025.


Originally Posted by FangsF15
As someone reminded me recently, though the last 'hire date" was in March, they were 9E flows that were held back, and actually completed indoc in May. So 5-ish months of hiring.
true

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Old 09-03-2025 | 05:12 PM
  #5517  
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If only Flt Ops had recently put out a podcast about Fleet Strategy.

​​​​​​https://deltaairlines.sharepoint.com...Episode-2.aspx
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Old 09-03-2025 | 05:13 PM
  #5518  
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We’re gonna grow. I seriously doubt we only hired 500-750 again as we felt the strain this year and hiring 500 would only strain the operation more. The 10’s aren’t getting certified anytime soon. If we were truly desperate for more 73’s we would’ve swapped to the -9’s and taken delivery already. Plus when it finally does get certified it’ll be riddled with issues just like the 8/9 have been. The lie flats also aren’t coming anytime soon. They just failed certification again not long ago and that entire project is just as of a mess. 220’s seem to be the only reliable NB we will be able to take delivery of in 2026. 35k’s have already been delayed. I’m sure we’ll see another WB order but it probably won’t even be half as much growth as UA has strived for. Mostly replacing are very old fleet. 75’s are incredibly tired. 76’s aren’t far behind. The 764’s can last awhile longer but it’s such a niche fleet they’ll probably follow the last 763’s out the door to the boneyards. We currently don’t have a true 763 replacement nor a true 757 replacement. The NEO is great but it is no 75 replacement and fills a different part of the market. It be wise to order some XLR’s. But it seems that ship may have sailed for the time being.
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Old 09-03-2025 | 05:16 PM
  #5519  
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Originally Posted by GogglesPisano
If only Flt Ops had recently put out a podcast about Fleet Strategy.

​​​​​​https://deltaairlines.sharepoint.com...Episode-2.aspx
I’m not listening to that junk. Besides we’re talking about the same flight ops that have routinely said one thing then done the opposite? Whether that’s opening a base or employee interface it’s always a load of malarkey.
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Old 09-03-2025 | 05:17 PM
  #5520  
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Originally Posted by Avgeek7248
I’m not listening to that junk. Besides we’re talking about the same flight ops that have routinely said one thing then done the opposite? Whether that’s opening a base or employee interface it’s always a load of malarkey.
Yes. I'm almost certain APC conjecture is more factual with greater access to reliable inside info.
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