Can I assume that is a TIC question? Or are you truly oblivious to the world around you? Just in case you haven't noticed, all the guys that are nearing retirement age have been in BK contracts during the majority of what should have been their prime earning years. But now I guess it is chic to throw them under the bus so that ftb can have a 70 seat airplane to drive around. I am just now getting to my prime earning years, so this isn't about me... it's about balance. Always has been.

Really....time for the junior guys makes it ok for the senior guys to trade scope for pay? I disagree. I am very junior here at Ma Del. I do not have a pension that is frozen, I do not have a pension that is a shell of its former self in the PBGC, I do not have ANY Delta retirement what so ever except the the 401K here, of which you also enjoy the same benefit from. I will never get a pension from Delta, not the even the deflated one you will recieve. There is no time for me to make up for what you already have.

Pay...well I think if you thought about it, my pay as a junior B has always been relative to what the A's and senior guys have made. So we have SHARED that burden of pay losses and benefited when the times were good, relative to each others respective position. Moving forward I will not have the earnings potential that you enjoyed in previous contracts(albiet brief) as the crack spread between what you made 20 years ago and what it could buy vs what I will make now to the next 10-20 years will buy.

Selfish...., I dont enjoy any of your benefits from any pension, I now make less than you did in my position, and I am stagant at the low end of the senority system because we gave up 5 years for you to recoupe your pension losses from a pension that I never had. Toss that in with the outsourceing of the low end jobs here and what I am left is a career that is worth SUBSTANTIALLY LESS than than what you have been able to recoupe.

Talk to me about selfish.

I voted against C12k, but I support the wishes of the majority of my pilot group, and I now support the contract as such.......but dont have the gall to call me selfish and try and to justify it by saying I have the luxury of time.

Tell me what a typical pilot in this demographic you speak of (prime years earner) has lost to the bankruptcy contracts. But show me hard numbers, none of this percentage BS, and I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. Hell, might even change my viewpoint.

You are gonna rocket thru the rest of your career. 5 years from now you will be where I am right now (in terms of seat progression). 10 years from now you won't give a rat's ass about 70 seat airplanes.

As to your musings about the pension and all... just... wow.

You know I don't have that kind of data. I think percentages apply, but I cannot answer that either, so it is a futile exercise. Frankly, none of it applies to me anyway, because I have always been a saver, but there are lots of guys out there that seem to be working paycheck to paycheck (I find that astonishing). But really that isnt the point of this discussion. It is about guys wanting the senior guys to forego any semblance of pay increases to go beyond what was accomplished in the latest contract, and to recapture flying that ain't coming back at any price anyway. And yes, I think it is selfish of them to talk that way. Balance. A living document. Think about it.

Some people have their head in the sand.... others like this guy are tunneled far underground in their own delusional reality.

All? How about the guys who worked for the dozens of companies that went under and had to start over at the bottom? You cant be an advocate for both the old and the senior, two different groups.
Carl was i beleive a 54 yo 744A. Thankfully he cared about scope enough to try sharing his point of view with others. I disagree that all junior people have the luxury of time to make up earnings and that all senior pilots spent their prime earning years in bk contracts.

The only thing that benefits both the young and the old is scope recapture. Scope sales only benefit the senior.

Forward looking projections, either positive or negative, especially in the airline business, are a fools errand. Certainly everyone in this business knows this by now. There is one thing I am personally certain of, DAL fltops would love for us to be the top of the pyramid...I am not certain that our BOD feels the same way. Guess who has the winning vote.

What they conveniently leave out is that contract C2K and its predecessor were paid for largely by scope sales.