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Originally Posted by Jesse
(Post 1261857)
He's just keeping us in suspense. Of course we are! We signed the TA, and as SD said in his update when we were deliberating the TA, a YES on the TA was going to be, to paraphrase, a step that would very likely lead to hiring in the 4th qtr this year. I was worried that the concessions we gave up in the TA regarding more flying for reserves, SCs, and loss of X days during the summer months would mean a need for less pilots. But that concern was allayed by my union when I was told the improvement to vacation would dictate a need for more pilots. So rest assured, we're going to hear about it any day now--hiring is coming soon!
Just for your info there were lots of areas in the contract that offset the job loss not just vacations. 1. Improved vacation pay 2. Improved training pay 3. Known absences counting toward a reserve being full. 4. Reserves full at the reserve guarantee instead of ALV. 5. Additional X days per year per reserve pilot 6. Elimation of trip parking. (this one was not costed out for jobs since it was a unintended side effect of the swap board.) Fixing this might offset all the job loss from ALV15 and 84 hours. The above items are all of the top of my head without evening looking at the contract for other items. As far as hiring or not hiring it bears repeating a common phrase. "It's the economy stupid." |
a-chimmy-chang-chong.... a-chimmy-chang-Chinese Raptor?
http://i.minus.com/iRKPEhUR1rM2c.png http://i.minus.com/ibm2t0GU3OfKsJ.jpg |
Originally Posted by sailingfun
(Post 1262034)
The contract is not going to be even a 1 percent factor in if we hire or not. It will come down 99 percent to the block hour plan for next summer. The economy will drive that.
Just for your info there were lots of areas in the contract that offset the job loss not just vacations. 1. Improved vacation pay 2. Improved training pay 3. Known absences counting toward a reserve being full. 4. Reserves full at the reserve guarantee instead of ALV. 5. Additional X days per year per reserve pilot 6. Elimation of trip parking. (this one was not costed out for jobs since it was a unintended side effect of the swap board.) Fixing this might offset all the job loss from ALV15 and 84 hours. The above items are all of the top of my head without evening looking at the contract for other items. As far as hiring or not hiring it bears repeating a common phrase. "It's the economy stupid." |
Originally Posted by Flamer
(Post 1262038)
Point of the original post was that there was a carrot signaling hiring this year. As soon as the TA was signed that went away. Smells just as fishy as the LGA slot swap. How many times do you think the average pilot can be tricked in such quick succession?
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Originally Posted by finis72
(Post 1262043)
Maybe I'm wrong but I don't believe SD said anything about starting to hire this fall. I think he said hiring would start in 2013 with possibility of starting the process (getting ready for hiring) in the fall.
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Originally Posted by sailingfun
(Post 1262034)
The contract is not going to be even a 1 percent factor in if we hire or not. It will come down 99 percent to the block hour plan for next summer. The economy will drive that.
Just for your info there were lots of areas in the contract that offset the job loss not just vacations. 1. Improved vacation pay 2. Improved training pay 3. Known absences counting toward a reserve being full. 4. Reserves full at the reserve guarantee instead of ALV. 5. Additional X days per year per reserve pilot 6. Elimation of trip parking. (this one was not costed out for jobs since it was a unintended side effect of the swap board.) Fixing this might offset all the job loss from ALV15 and 84 hours. The above items are all of the top of my head without evening looking at the contract for other items. As far as hiring or not hiring it bears repeating a common phrase. "It's the economy stupid." "...Conclusion: The analysis described in this Touch & Gos is based on flat system-wide capacity, which is less than what Delta is predicting. If capacity grows, the staffing differences predicted above would be even greater. Under the TA, there are hard caps placed on the number of DCI aircraft and therefore all growth flying must go to mainline. Flight Operations recently announced that they are prepared to begin the pilot hiring process as early as the fourth quarter of this year. This is consistent with the analysis contained in this Touch & Gos. Once the hiring starts, it will likely continue at a steady pace for several years...." I guess the "stupid" part has to do with believing what you are told during a ratification sales job. The "economy" has become the scapegoat, taking the heat off the fact that this TA was sold to the pilots relying on too many overly optimistic assumptions. |
Originally Posted by sailingfun
(Post 1262030)
Yet less then 8 months into the start of the process a substantial number of mainline jobs have been created and it looks like more will be coming from the NY swap. Sailing, I repeat, I say I repeat "This is great news." Here is my whole post again since you appear to be ignoring parts of it. Scoop Sailing, In general your post is correct with the exception highlighted in red. It was a huge "surprise" to 90% of the Pilot group. Yes, mainline is slowly replacing the RJs and growing at LGA - this is great news. But do you honestly think most of us were not surprised with the 90% initial RJ rollout after our lobbying efforts? And while I agree that we should all do our share and help out when able, this is the result of the perceived "bait and switch" on the initial LGA swap - many Pilots are now distrustful and a few will not participate in these programs any more. In hindsight perhaps the company should have been a little more forthright about the initial RJ rollout. They have been pretty good about explaining it after the fact, but many feel we were initially mislead. Scoop |
Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp
(Post 1262036)
a-chimmy-chang-chong.... a-chimmy-chang-Chinese Raptor?
http://i.minus.com/iRKPEhUR1rM2c.png http://i.minus.com/ibm2t0GU3OfKsJ.jpg |
Originally Posted by TANSTAAFL
(Post 1262059)
I guess the "stupid" part has to do with believing what you are told during a ratification sales job. The "economy" has become the scapegoat, taking the heat off the fact that this TA was sold to the pilots relying on too many overly optimistic assumptions. The company's SEC filing shows significant mainline growth through 2015, as the mainline grows from 730 to 796 aircraft. I don't think anyone predicted immediate mainline growth, particularly since the new mainline 100 seater was going to arrive until the second half of 2013. I'm looking forward to the maiine growth this improved scope will bring the mainline. |
Originally Posted by TANSTAAFL
(Post 1262059)
Funny, T&G 12-06 never mentioned the economy as a caveat when shilling for the TA with growth forecasts.
"...Conclusion: The analysis described in this Touch & Gos is based on flat system-wide capacity, which is less than what Delta is predicting. If capacity grows, the staffing differences predicted above would be even greater. Under the TA, there are hard caps placed on the number of DCI aircraft and therefore all growth flying must go to mainline. Flight Operations recently announced that they are prepared to begin the pilot hiring process as early as the fourth quarter of this year. This is consistent with the analysis contained in this Touch & Gos. Once the hiring starts, it will likely continue at a steady pace for several years...." I guess the "stupid" part has to do with believing what you are told during a ratification sales job. The "economy" has become the scapegoat, taking the heat off the fact that this TA was sold to the pilots relying on too many overly optimistic assumptions. Nu |
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