Originally Posted by Timbo (Post 1433274)

I doubt your ticket is on the line, when you are practicing in the sim. That's why God invented Sims, so you can practice, in a safe environment.

Originally Posted by Bucking Bar (Post 1433310)

Why shouldn't the widebodies be fenced? Alaska has none, no reference to them in their PWA and no scope to protect them from outsourcing Alaska to Delta (except for their 737's).

Originally Posted by Bucking Bar (Post 1433310)

Why shouldn't the widebodies be fenced? Alaska has none, no reference to them in their PWA and no scope to protect them from outsourcing Alaska to Delta (except for their 737's).

Originally Posted by Purple Drank (Post 1433334)

I agree. I was highly proficient hand-flying heavy 4-engine jets on raw data with no autothrottles when I was hired. Delta has implicitly discouraged hand-flying in every fleet I've been on, more so all the time. I don't consider myself to be proficient at this point. And most guys I fly with are even worse off than I am.

I am fully on board with training raw data/no AP in the sim. I'd like to see it more! I just feel that we should be adequately (re)trained first prior to Delta mandating it on the line--a mandate which appears to be forthcoming. Of course there's a cost to Delta associated with that. But they could have avoided that cost by being less obsessive about VNAV/AP-on procedures over the years. Now it's on them to pony up an extra hour or two (or more) in the sim for guys if they expect us to do this on the line. It's the cost of doing business which they--not we--must foot.

If the company continues to push no-FD hand-flying without adequately retraining us, and thereby expecting us to become proficient on our own dime on the line...that's a foul.

Originally Posted by Check Essential (Post 1433301)

I strongly disagree.

Let's look at DALPA's own example from PBS Notepad 13-03.


Scenario 2: One week of vacation resulting in two blocks

Bidder has one PVAC week worth 22:45 from 09-15 June.
Result: Vacation Any is honored and places PVAC in two blocks, 06 June and 15-20 June.

1. Start Pairings
2. Set Condition Vacation Any
PVAC 2013-06-06 00:00 2013-06-06 23:59 (003:15)
PVAC 2013-06-15 00:00 2013-06-20 23:59 (019:30)
Honored
(2 Awarded, 2 Matching, Running total: 022:45)
3. Award Pairings If Departing On Monday, Wednesday, Friday If Pairing Length = 1 days
C603 2013-06-05 06:37 2013-06-05 17:00 (007:53) (A)
C610 2013-06-10 07:45 2013-06-10 18:16 (007:59) (A)
C282 2013-06-12 10:25 2013-06-12 17:49 (005:15) (A)
C610 2013-06-14 07:45 2013-06-14 18:16 (007:59) (A)
C610 2013-06-21 07:45 2013-06-21 18:16 (007:59) (A)
C610 2013-06-24 07:45 2013-06-24 18:16 (007:59) (A)
C610 2013-06-26 07:45 2013-06-26 18:16 (007:59) (A)
C610 2013-06-28 07:45 2013-06-28 18:16 (007:59) (A)
Schedule is complete: 43
(8 Awarded, 32 Matching, Running total: 083:47)

This guy is able to split his vacation that should have started on June 9th. As a result he can bid for and receive Rotations C610, C282 and another C610 for a nice 83:47 month.

Sure, its possible he could have used other trips to construct a line worth the same but it would presumably be less desirable and more difficult and the further you get down the category list and the fewer trips remain the more difficult it will be. He might not get those sweet one day trips worth 8 hours.

So our example pilot is able to more easily build a complete line and more easily build it to the top of the LCW.
That will happen on down the list.
The result of all that will be more trips covered by guys with vacations and fewer trips remaining in open time and fewer reserves required to cover the open flying.

Riddle me this --
What is the purpose of 'Vacation Any"?

Originally Posted by Ferd149 (Post 1433344)

Bar is, as usual, correct. Remember, we have a status and category list. WB A, NB A, WB B, NB B. Their most senior "job" would be way down our list. I'm sure FTB or Clamp have the overall ratio for AK 737s vs our TOTAL narrowbody fleet. I would suggest it won't be pretty for them, assuming we don't let them wiggle too much as a welcome aboard thingie:D

I'm not saying that the bottom of the list won't be effected and I do think ALL of their post 2010 hires go below our junior guys, but I like our odds as the surviving carrier and the bigger mofo. Psssssttt I've been on the other side of that equation:D

Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp (Post 1433347)

And FYI- VNAV/managed works the same with the AP on as it does with the AP off, so that doesn't count.

Originally Posted by Purple Drank (Post 1433357)

I find that using VNAV without an FD and AP is like flying a raw data ILS. Have you found otherwise?

It's my perception that if I was to fly without the FD and AP on a checkride, even flawlessly, I would be heavily debriefed.

Originally Posted by Purple Drank (Post 1433258)

That sounds like a wonderful idea from the brain trust in flight ops. "No AP/no FD on the mad dog! Let's put a in a five minute segment at recurrent to get them back up to speed. Then they're good to go!"

It's ludicrous for the company to think we're going to put our tickets on the line doing raw-data hand flying after years of beating us senseless for doing so.