Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
12-19-2013 | 01:46 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 467
Likes: 0
From: SLC ERB
Hypothetical 7 day trip:
Day 1: report 1900, 5 hour FDP, 14 hour layover
Day 2: 10 hour FDP, 14 hour layover
Day 3: 10 hour FDP, 14 hour layover
Day 4: 10 hour FDP, 14 hour layover
Day 5: 10 hour FDP, 11 hour layover
Day 6: 10 hour FDP, 11 hour layover
Day 7: 5 hour FDP. Block in at 1300
138 hours from report to block in. 60 total FDP hours. No 30 hour breaks, no 24 hour breaks.
At 1300 on day 7 you still had 30 hours off in the previous 168.
Legal under 117. Not legal under current FAR's
Yes, it's pushed right at the limit. No, we would probably never actually see a trip like this (never say never?). But a hypothetical trip like this is a good way to get a feel for what is possible under the new rules.
12-19-2013 | 02:03 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,707
Likes: 0
From: Permanently scarred
The original question was, can you work a 4 day trip followed by a 3 day trip and not have a 30 hour break somewhere in the middle? The answer is yes, it is possible. You can work 7 flight duty periods in 7 days without a 30 hour break. Sure, it would require a late report on day 1 and an early release on day 7 (and it would need to be under 60 total flight duty period hours), but it's is possible. Under the old rules it would not be legal due to the 24 off in 7 calendar days requirement. That's all I was trying say. 
12-19-2013 | 02:32 PM
Moderator
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,263
Likes: 105
From: DAL 330
Well sure, old rules, new rules - as long as they kept giving you the necessary breaks, you could be at work indefinitely, I guess.
Hypothetical 7 day trip:
Day 1: report 1900, 5 hour FDP, 14 hour layover
Day 2: 10 hour FDP, 14 hour layover
Day 3: 10 hour FDP, 14 hour layover
Day 4: 10 hour FDP, 14 hour layover
Day 5: 10 hour FDP, 11 hour layover
Day 6: 10 hour FDP, 11 hour layover
Day 7: 5 hour FDP. Block in at 1300
138 hours from report to block in. 60 total FDP hours. No 30 hour breaks, no 24 hour breaks.
At 1300 on day 7 you still had 30 hours off in the previous 168.
Legal under 117. Not legal under current FAR's
Yes, it's pushed right at the limit. No, we would probably never actually see a trip like this (never say never?). But a hypothetical trip like this is a good way to get a feel for what is possible under the new rules.
Hypothetical 7 day trip:
Day 1: report 1900, 5 hour FDP, 14 hour layover
Day 2: 10 hour FDP, 14 hour layover
Day 3: 10 hour FDP, 14 hour layover
Day 4: 10 hour FDP, 14 hour layover
Day 5: 10 hour FDP, 11 hour layover
Day 6: 10 hour FDP, 11 hour layover
Day 7: 5 hour FDP. Block in at 1300
138 hours from report to block in. 60 total FDP hours. No 30 hour breaks, no 24 hour breaks.
At 1300 on day 7 you still had 30 hours off in the previous 168.
Legal under 117. Not legal under current FAR's
Yes, it's pushed right at the limit. No, we would probably never actually see a trip like this (never say never?). But a hypothetical trip like this is a good way to get a feel for what is possible under the new rules.
Now I see what you were getting at. Due to the 168 hour rolling window the "30 hour break" precedes working 7 calendar days in a row with no intervening break.
I agree, not a pretty picture, and hard to believe that this is under the new "scientifically based" rules.
Just another example of "the Man keeping us down."
Scoop
12-19-2013 | 02:38 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 277
Likes: 0
From: JFK A-330 A
I just downloaded the ALPA 117 app, just in case. (Never know when a crew-mate may need some help.) Took all of two minutes.
iPhone-->App Store..search ALPA--> scroll over and install.
"So easy, even a Captain can do it!"
iPhone-->App Store..search ALPA--> scroll over and install.
"So easy, even a Captain can do it!"
12-19-2013 | 02:39 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 277
Likes: 0
From: JFK A-330 A
I just downloaded the ALPA 117 app, just in case. (Never know when a crew-mate may need some help.) Took all of two minutes.
iPhone-->App Store..search ALPA--> scroll over and install.
"So easy, even a Captain can do it!"
iPhone-->App Store..search ALPA--> scroll over and install.
"So easy, even a Captain can do it!"
Last edited by DFW Refugee; 12-19-2013 at 02:43 PM. Reason: Double post.
12-19-2013 | 03:36 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 5,113
Likes: 0
So easy a Captain can do it... twice 
12-19-2013 | 04:12 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,206
Likes: 0
From: DAL FO
From the ALPA Guide: "Before beginning any reserve or FDP assignment, the flightcrew member must have received a 30
consecutive-hour rest within the past 168 consecutive
hours that precedes the beginning of the FDP."
The key: this is a look back rule. By the end of that last FDP you may be able to look back 168hrs and not see 30 consecutive hours rest -- and still be legal.
consecutive-hour rest within the past 168 consecutive
hours that precedes the beginning of the FDP."
The key: this is a look back rule. By the end of that last FDP you may be able to look back 168hrs and not see 30 consecutive hours rest -- and still be legal.
12-19-2013 | 04:43 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 225
Likes: 0
From: 73
Spring non-rev question. I would like to take the family to one of the seasonal European locations at the beginning of Jun. Most of these locations (Athens, Prague etc) don't start service until the end of May. How crazy are loads when these routes just start up? Are they full from the get-go or does it take a few weeks until the heavy summer loads take effect. Will travel on S-2 just like most other active employees. Thanks!
12-19-2013 | 04:46 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 467
Likes: 0
From: SLC ERB
Now I see what you were getting at. Due to the 168 hour rolling window the "30 hour break" precedes working 7 calendar days in a row with no intervening break.
I agree, not a pretty picture, and hard to believe that this is under the new "scientifically based" rules.
Just another example of "the Man keeping us down."
Scoop
I agree, not a pretty picture, and hard to believe that this is under the new "scientifically based" rules.
Just another example of "the Man keeping us down."
Scoop
12-19-2013 | 05:20 PM
Line Holder
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
I'm trying to wrap my brain around our current and future reserve obligations. I'm just about 9 weeks from starting my 28 th year and find myself on reserve in January in ATL on the 320. I REALLY don't like reserve but here I am. Here is why. Delta offered all 320. Captains that had January vacation to sell it back to the company. Apparently to cover 717 trips and charter ops with the new FARs.
System wide- 690-vacation days were given back. 89 pilots participated.
In ATL, 10 pilots participated for a total of 71
That equates to 38 percent of ATL320A pilots on reserve! Even if you're just about to start your 28th year! Yikes
System wide- 690-vacation days were given back. 89 pilots participated.
In ATL, 10 pilots participated for a total of 71
That equates to 38 percent of ATL320A pilots on reserve! Even if you're just about to start your 28th year! Yikes
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
