I get a kick out of many of the posts. Most just totally ignore the process. Going into Contract 2012 there were reps elected to be new blood. In reality there is always new blood. We generally elect pretty good people. There are not idiots. When contract negotiations come up they are given a lot of data some of which the line pilot does not see. Some of it is political in nature. There in lies the problem. You may desire a certain outcome but if that outcome is not possible given the process what then happens? In most cases reps with a reasonable level of intelligence decide to attempt to get a result with the best quality of life and most compensation with the limits of the process.
In contract 2015 there are many steps in the process. We are at the very beginning of a long journey. Those line pilots who choose to will be able to educate themselves on most things. Some will not bother. The first step which we are just starting will be to provide the pilots data and then survey the group.
From those results our opener will be crafted. We will then exchange those openers. The political aspect of the contract may begin even before the openers are exchanged. I mean could something as strange as the head of the NMB flying to Atlanta to address the MEC on ground rules occur? Once openers are exchanged we will attempt to narrow the issues. Depending on motivation this could be quick or very long. If however the desires of both sides are so far apart that no solution is possible we will have to go to the NMB.
This is were politics rules. First we need to get the NMB to get involved and accept is into mediation. They have a current backlog that is huge. They probably will not involve themselves until we are 2 to 3 years past the amendable date. At that point we have to feel out Congress and the executive branch to determine the level of support we can expect and how much pressure we can bring to bear on the NMB. Most of that pressure will come from Congress. The company will of course be doing the same thing.
The NMB will base any decision to release us to self help on how reasonable they view our demands relative to the companies demands and how much outside pressure they are getting from congress. Long before this point the NMB will have made it very clear to the MEC how reasonable they view our table position. The same message will be sent to the company. If we are outside the NMB's self described zone of reasonableness then we will not be released and will be as the expression goes iced. AMR ignored what the NMB told then and the result was predicatable.
There are things pilots can do to exert pressure as mentioned in other posts. Every pilot should be aware of what is contained in their contract. Pilots should honor that contract especially after the contract has reached its amendable date. They should also make their feelings known at company roadshows and when they can talk with their CP's. Those discussions due matter. At this point we also need a cohesive pilot group.
DPA once put out a nice letter on how important all this was and explained why they would stop their process long enough before contract 2012 to insure it did not take money from our pockets by dividing the group. Sadly they later choose to ignore their own letter. Sounds like they plan to ignore it again.
During this whole process everything we desire will be costed out. In the end all the data is basically distilled into one number. That is pilot costs per block hour. Its the number that takes into account both compensation and productivity. That number will be compared to the industry. If you look at those numbers now they are sobering. AMR, SWA and UAL have done us no favors at all. AMR and UAL are now locked out of the process until years after our amendable date. SWA has been in negotiations for over 2 years with no real progress.
The above points to a need to try and explore other metrics to justify our desires. I actually agree with some of what is posted on here about looking at things from different aspects. Getting alternative views of what is reasonable through to the NMB will not be easy and again require political pressure be brought into the mix. The next Presidential election could also be critical. A heavily anti labor president will hurt. A week and ineffective democrat will also do us no favors.
In the end the question becomes what is the smartest move to put the most money in your pocket. Reach a agreement that may fall short of your goals or risk a protracted 3 to 6 year process. Each pilot will get to make that as a personal decision. There is not right or wrong. The MEC will have to decide what they feel is best for the pilot group overall. Eventually the individual pilot will have to decide what best for their situation and family via ratification.
I stand by my original statement on the forum. This will in the end be a long and difficult fight. RA has never as far as I can research ever allowed his costs in any business to get much above his competition. I don't see him doing it now and I don't think we will bridge that gap without a release from the NMB. I hope each pilot is prepared for that battle.

What you might call (sic.) "adding intellectual relevance" to the discussion, I characterize it as a red herring, straw man, idiotic argument into which I will not venture, because it is meaningless and, well... idiotic. But, if you reread my post I pretty much agreed that virtually nobody had that on their survey. So I answered your stupid question. Now go right ahead and spin it into something it isn't.

So, in other words, when all future projections say "huge profits", there is a mediocre pay raise. Just imagine what will happen when the "forecast" is downturn in 2016/2017. Sounds to me like you were being "managed" already.

You may want to look up global travel demand, world population and the aircraft on order. I'm thinking this might tell another story.

[QUOTE=DALMD88FO;1681774]I talked to some SLC reps while on a productivity sit in SLC. They had their power point up and running about the state of the union. What I walked away with is that they, meaning DALPA, is going to try and avoid protracted negotiations because our financial people are speculating that there is going to be a down turn in either 2016 or 2017.

Randy is getting started early to lower expectations and sell us out for less.

Downturn 2016?

In 2015 the United States will produce over 80% of our energy needs domestically.

Our economy is just getting started.

Minimum of 20% to 25% date of signing. Period. Once again the survey will show the overwhelming majority in this range or more.

We will not be ignored this time.

I know it's a little late, but there is a link to said spreadsheet on the PBS info page. Hopefully you get this in time to bid still.

Let the lowering of expectations begin.

"Don't worry about pay banding, we practically have it now."

"Reducing profit sharing is a win."

"There is an economic downturn coming in 2016-2017"

"RA will never let our pay rates get too far above our peers"

"We can't make gains because the other employees will want them too"

The pilots here who write this nonsense are very connected and very powerful. No matter that they are kool aid drinking, surrender monkeys carrying management's water and stabbing the Delta pilots in the back.

There are a thousand reasons why we deserve and will attain "historic" gains in C2015, but the fact that management is sending $2.75 BILLION back to the shareholders in a second round of buy backs and dividends says it all. The profits and free cash flow are so large management does not know what to do with the money so they are returning it to the shareholders.

They could have spent this money restoring our bankruptcy contract. They could have paid down the debt further. They could have bought more aircraft. Yet they shrugged their shoulders and said we have so much money we don't know what to do with it, so we are returning it to you.

Call and write your reps. Back them 100% on their promise of a "historic" C2015. Ref: True headings 14-2 page 3.

I'm waiting for someone to offer a rebuttal with an equal level of logic and reasoning as T put forth here. Such a rebuttal of an equivalent level of effort and reasonableness would be close to: "You're an idiot because I don't agree with your point of view."

Child, you can do better.

I had three legs today, one of which transited a base with poor weather.

- On one leg, I called into ops to request numbers 3 minutes after push. "Oh, the agent hasn't input the final count." We might still be waiting for numbers without that call (time saved Delta: ?)

- On another leg, I referenced my own iDevice real-time weather app that identified the dispatcher's irrational routing. Discussed with captain, who convinced dispatcher to change back to direct routing (time saved Delta: 34 minutes).

- On the third leg, as a team player, I made a judgment call (well, I ran it by the captain, who agreed with me) not to write up a discrepancy that, while not strictly a safety issue, could have put the flight way behind. Instead, held off until the hub. Time saved Delta: ?

I estimate my proactivity and teamwork today saved at least 90 minutes and kept three flights on time, plus a bunch of fuel. One crew. One day.

There's our leverage.

Problem is...does the company even realize to what extent we drive the operation?

How do we educate them (and stay legal)? Perhaps DALPA can start a web-based system where we log our contributions to keeping the operation running...and invite the company to verify.

Just spitballing here...

It's called..........wait for it...............being a PROFESSIONAL! :confused:

Your post reads like:

blah..blah..blah, I performed my duties today, as a professional.

And if the company doesn't come to an agreement in my specified amount of time.....blah......blah.....blah....I will do my best to act.....unprofessional. :o

Maybe, but another way to look at it is, that is what people do when morale is high. So are saying that if you are a "professional" you cannot go above and beyond what is expected............... because a professional is expected to go above and beyond? :confused:

We are not breaking any new ground here - things are going good and people are happy - that could change, hopefully it will not.

Scoop