I would agree with you if everyone could hold a position in any base they wished. However, some of us moved and chose NOT to commute. Then we merge and they shuffle airplanes around. Now some guys who did that cannot hold a position in the base they moved to. So now to chose to NOT commute they have to sell a house that they most likely owe more on than what it is worth and pay closing costs and fees on top of that. I am lucky that I can still hold my base (for now). However if I wanted to move to say MSP, it would cost me over 60K to get out of my current house, move, and buy another.

There are alot of guys who are going to be commuters who have no choice due to this merger so making commuting easier should be an item we improve for everyone. I'm not a commuter and hope to never be one, but I would sure hope we can improve the commuting life just in case I'm ever forced into it. And FWIW, the 5-day SLC trips do look commutable. I guess we'll see if the commuters bid them or guys like me who are on reserve end up doing all of them.

Scoop below gets it. In my scenario, I'm commuting the same and working less days. Why wouldn't you want that?

Not really. As someone posted a few pages back, they wanted the 5-day trips, but in the end, the junior folks got stuck with them. I guess nobody really wanted them after all.

If someone wants 5-day trips, let them pattern bid and put together 2 and 3-day trips. This is very easy with PBS. In fact, you could build those trips so there are commutable legs on the front and back.

Otherwise, 5-day trips aren't productive and mean more time away from home for less money for the rest of us.

The vast majority of pilots who commute do so because they are living where their wife is from, they are living where they are from or they are living where their last job was before Delta. Some are forced to commute by base closures with DFW heading the list but the majority simply are living where they choose. I am a life long commuter however I wont play the I was forced to do it card.

All of this discussion about commuting could be for nothing. Uncle Sam has his hands in the commuting cookie jar. There's no way in hell to determine how or what the FAA is going to come up with.

I really do think the FAA is going to crackdown on commuting, thus forcing pilots to come in the night/day before a trip to ensure proper rest.

The Colgan Families are pushing for this.

I disagree - the FAA has to get a cost benefit for everything they do. If the FAA starts requiring everyone to come in the night before - the first thing the pilot unions will require is the company to provide the hotel for them - because "it's FAA required". (even if not a commuter - who is to say a 2 hr drive through ATL traffic from the north side is relaxing)

This would be a dramatic cost - one the airlines will fight tooth and nail (but do it behind the scenes).

It really came down to some very simple positions. The Delta guys wanted a prenup on seniority that would be a staple. Comair refused and wanted ALPA merger policy meaning arbitration. If there was going to be a prenup all they would agree to was DOH. Looking at ALPA merger policy it is possible that Captains would go at the bottom of the Captains list and FO's stapled. That would have been very unfair to Delta's FO's.

It was all really a wasted exercise as there was virtually nothing we could have given up to convince the company to merge the airlines and there was nothing in our contract to force the issue. It was never going to happen.
The real missed opportunity would have been Comair and ASA filing for a single carrier determination with the NMB. There was precedent from AE to almost make that a lock. Why it never happened I don't know but I am told that the two MEC could not agree on almost any points to go that route.

There are airlines that do already provide rooms before crews start rotations. We might have to realize that this might become the cost of doing business. And as such, commuting might become a thing of the past because I certainly don't many companies providing rooms because someone commutes.

CHANGED: Additionally, the FAA could put forth language such as "A pilot must have 8 hours of uninterupted crew rest within the 12 hours before start of a rotation/flight segment". Since the FAA is requiring you the pilot and not the company, I could see this being a way of them getting their crew rest while not forcing undue costs onto the company.

Additionally, I think we all should be intellectually honest with ourselves and realize the vast differences between someone getting a good nights rest at home and driving to work, compared to someone sleeping on the red-eye or in the crew lounge (which is what they're trying to prevent).

I don't know if anything will become of this "Academy of Science Study" requirement, but it's not going to be as simple as "cracking down" on commuting. For starters, airlines will quietly push back against it. They don't want the discontent that will ensue, and I don't think they want to bear the cost of relocating people to appropriate bases. And they certainly don't want to build rotations with paid commuting built-in.

My guess is that IF we see some move to curtail commuting, there will be a lot of fast negotiating on virtual bases, or satellite bases, or some sort of flexible arrangement to originate from home.

I'm not a commuter, so I'm not pushing for this, but I don't see a wholesale limit on commuting without some accomodation of the realties involved. There is a erason commuting has been quitely ignored as a fatigue factor, and I think it goes beyond the impracticalities of a ban: the current system basically relies on commuting.

Imagine the AE's,MD's, and paid moves without it.

Sorry, hoser, you're wrong. ATL is NOT more senior, SLC and LAX only marginally so. Bottom line: no one hired prior to 2007 got kicked out of those bases, except by choice. And if anyone hired in 2007+ bought a house that is now $100,000 under water, they were a fool.

Look, I have no problem with guys commuting. We have pilots living in TPA, JAX, TYS, CHS, PNS, -- none of which were EVER a pilot base at DAL or NWA. That's fine. That's their CHOICE. I just don't think we should have to move mountains to accommodate their personal choice. That's all. Every $ spent to accommodate the additional cost to the corporation, is one dollar less that can be paid to those of us that DID elect to move to one of the many cities DAL (or NWA) had a crew base in. If your base closes, I do sympathize, and I'd be more than willing to pay positive space for 5 years, until you can move. But for the majority of commuters, who live where they live simply because they want to, I don't like making less, so they can do that.

It could happen. But when I got hired by DAL, I moved to ATL. Figured it was the safest place to be to AVOID uprooting my family. So far, its worked. No guarantees for the future. I have no disdain for the commuter, hoser. What I DO have disdain for, is the entitlement mentality, that thinks the pilot group ought to pay the price so you can live in East Bumble, just cause you want to. NO other corporation tolerates that mentality, why do we? Both of my siblings have moved to where the job was, but somehow we think pilots should be different. There isn't a six figure job out there, where you can live in ANY city in the WORLD that you want, except ours. And I respect that right. But don't make me pay for it, and those who want all these concessions for commuters are asking for that very thing.